Hosea 9:15
15 All their wickedness is in Gilgal: for there I hated them: for the wickedness of their doings I will drive them out of mine house, I will love them no more: all their princes are revolters.

Malachi 1:2-3
2 I have loved you, saith the Lord. Yet ye say, Wherein hast thou loved us? Was not Esau Jacob's brother? saith the Lord: yet I loved Jacob,
3 And I hated Esau, and laid his mountains and his heritage waste for the dragons of the wilderness.

Malachi 2:17
17 Ye have wearied the Lord with your words. Yet ye say, Wherein have we wearied him? When ye say, Every one that doeth evil is good in the sight of the Lord, and he delighteth in them; or, Where is the God of judgment?

John 15:10
10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

Jude 21
21 Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.

John UK wrote:
Kev, you see? MS has just brought up the subject already. Did you make a deal or not?

John UK wrote:
That's it, Kev. I'll not mention it any more myself until the spring.

John Yurich USA wrote:
No I did not prevaricate about what Pastor stated.

John Yurich USA wrote:
The Calvinist doctrine that there are the elect is satanic according to Pastor Steve of that Baptist Church I attend on Sunday mornings.

John Yurich USA wrote:
The Calvinist doctrine that there are the elect is satanic according to Pastor Steve of that Baptist Church I attend on Sunday mornings.

4 According as he hath CHOSEN US IN HIM BEFORE the FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

5 Having PREDESTINATED US UNTO THE ADOPTION OF CHILDREN by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

6 To the praise of the glory of his grace, wherein he hath made us accepted in the beloved.

Romans 8:29-30

29 For whom he did FOREKNOW, HE ALSO DID PREDESTINATE TO BE CONFORMED to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

30 Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.

John Y you should guard your tougue against blaspheming the word of God.

ladybug wrote:
will do Kev

ladybug wrote:
To the elect of God
I have good news, I just received an e-mail from Bro. Observer, he is well and prospering in the Lord. Here is a snippet, "I continue to pray for many of the friends on SA, though I have little to do with many of them anymore. I've not visited the site since I announced leaving and am not even tempted to visit ... the place is rife with people who are pretty clueless ... the blind leading the blind ... and the few who do really know the grace of God are ridiculed and treated with derision. I fear it will only get worse."
Our dear brother is right. Such is the times in which we live.

MS wrote:
Interesting how AM wanted to deter the listening of the sermon that Kev recommended.

1 Corinthians 13:11

11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I UNDERSTOOD AS A CHILD, I thought as a child: but when I BECAME A MAN, I PUT AWAY childish things.

We are to study to show ourselves approved rightly dividing the word of God.

Another Michael wrote:
Well he ingeniously took verses either/or out of context, twisted & proof texted to fit..

I am telling you that in a sense it was finished just as Jesus was seen slain since the foundation of the world. Just as we were chosen in Him to be holy and blameless before the father in love since the foundation of the world. Just as the kingdom Jesus made by His blood the saints of old entered into since the foundation of the world. Just as they OT saints entered the rest of Jesus Christ thought His works in time where not finished.

If Jesus is seen as SLAIN from the foundation of the world is it not true that in a sense the works were done since the foundation of the world?

So when in time is the foundation of the world that all these verse use this phrase? Are you saying that the term foundation of the world means the 7th day? I believe it means before that.

Rodney K. wrote:
@John UK:
I for one don't believe that unsaved mankind has free will.

Unprofitable Servant wrote:
I am not sure we are going to go any place in this discussion brother, but I will try to respond later, the good Lord willing. Currently a tad under the weather, so calling it a night if you will bear with me. Thanks, for your response and understanding. God bless.

How is although used.

I rested from my work of building the house ALTHOUGH the work was finished since morning. The although makes it clear that that part following pertains to the part before it. The work that it is talking about is redemptive work and after the although tells when. 7th day rest of creation was a picture of the finished work of Christ:

Colossians 2:16-17

16 Let no man therefore judge you in meat, or in drink, or in respect of an holyday, or of the new moon, or of the SABBATH days:

17 Which ARE A SHADOW of things to come; but the body is of Christ.

How can the works be considered finished since the foundation of the world? The same way as Christ is the Lamb SLAIN from the foundation of the world:

Rev 13:8
And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the LAMB SLAIN FROM THE FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD.

I hope you are at least trying to understand what I am pointing out. When a specific phrase is repeated there is a purpose.

Now context of the verse before the verse in question:

Heb 4:2

2 For unto us was the gospel preached, AS WELL UNTO THEM: but the word preached DID NOT PROFIT them, not being mixed with FAITH in them that heard it.

The...Salvation rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

The works that are addressed in this situation refer to the the finished work of the cross. The English sentence structure is clear.

The key to understanding it is the term: FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD. This term shows up only 12 times in scripture and none in Genesis. Let’s look at some:

How was this Kingdom prepared? With the blood of Christ. Since when was it?:
Matthew 25:34
Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the KINGDOM PREPARED for you FROM the FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD:

When were we chosen IN CHRIST?:
Ephesians 1:4
According as he hath CHOSEN US IN HIM before the FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

Read this verse see the pattern:
Hebrews 9:26
For then must he often have suffered since the FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD: but now once IN THE END of the world hath he APPEARED to put away sin by the sacrifice of himself.

Compare to the above
1 Peter 1:20
Who verily was FOREORDAINED before the FOUNDATION OF THE WORLD, but WAS MANIFEST in these last times for you,

Unprofitable Servant wrote:
Kev, before I address your usage of Hebrews 4, I need you to be kind enough to elucidate what you are saying this passage means
although the works were finished from the foundation of the world. 
Thanks, retiring for the night. God bless.

Hebrews 4:3

3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

Mt 21:26 But if we shall say, Of men; we fear the people; FOR ALL HOLD JOHN AS A PROPHET. (Did 100% of "all" the people think John was a prophet?)

Mr 1:37 And when they had found him, they said unto him, ALL MEN seek for thee. (100%, Really?)

Mr 13:13 And ye shall be HATED OF ALL MEN for my name’s sake: but he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. (100% of the people in the world hate because of Christ?)

Lu 3:15 And as the people were in expectation, and ALL MEN MUSED in their hearts of John, whether he were the Christ, or not; (100% every human being?)

Lu 4:15 And he taught in their synagogues, being GLORIFIED OF ALL. (Everyone glorified him? 100%?)

Lu 11:41 But rather give alms of such things as ye have; and, behold, all things are clean unto you.
(All things clean)Luke20:6,21:38,etc.. All has to mean 100%?

Of course not! The way “all” and “world” are used in the Bible do not fit that construct that some try to apply to the words. Does scripture contradict itself? Nope. Read and answer Ladybugs excellent comment AM.

Unprofitable Servant wrote:
We are translated from darkness into the kingdom of His dear Son based upon the finished work of Christ. Remember God is not bound by time but we are. Hebrews 4 by the way is speaking of His work of creation.

4 Let us therefore fear, lest, a promise being left us of entering into his rest, any of you should seem to come short of it.

2 For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it.

3 For we which have believed do enter into rest, as he said, As I have sworn in my wrath, if they shall enter into my rest: although the works were finished from the foundation of the world.

It’s late for me posting meditate on the rest mentioned in Heb 4.