Discerning Believer wrote:
JD,
That IS the point I have been trying to make all along.

Discerning Believer wrote:
The missing ingredient I don't see in your group is God's grace, you have to add a human equation to the mix.

Good point.

We can conclude that there are three ingredients to justification.

God: The justifier
Faith: the means to justification
Blood: the source of justification

God has ordained that he will justify anyone that places his faith in the blood of Christ.

Discerning Believer wrote:
No man can come to Christ except the Father draws him by His power.

Discerning Believer wrote:
There is only one who can justify and that is God. If he conditions it upon faith, it is still God who justifies.

Go ahead, say it. It's very theraputic once you try it.

Discerning Believer wrote:
You can't honestly clain the God justifies as well as our faith justifies.

Pay attention to the question: "Is justification BY faith?"

Now do you want to get back on point?

Discerning Believer wrote:
I'm done.

Noone here is denying that salvation is a gift.

Like any gift, it can be received or rejected.

Have you ever received a gift? Do you not have to receive it?

Now how is it that when it comes to salvation you have such a hard time accepting such a simple concept?

The Bible makes it clear that it is faith that justifies NOT unconditional election.

You can't explain away the simple verses that state otherwise:

Romans 3:28 wrote:
Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith

Romans 3:30 wrote:
Seeing it is one God, which shall justify the circumcision by faith, and uncircumcision through faith.

Romans 5:1 wrote:
Therefore being justified by faith

Galatians 3:11 wrote:
But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.

Galatians 3:24 wrote:
Wherefore the law was our schoolmaster to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justified by faith.

You are right. Sorry DB, I should try to be more tactful.

_______________________________________

DB, so I guess your answer is no and to the survey question.

So if it is not faith that justifies, would you say that it is unconditional election that justifies?

And how do you explain so many verses that specifically state that faith is what justifies and an individual.

Your anology is a good one. Unfortunately it betrays your position. One cannot simply become a Nevadan by walking up to a precinct. And one is certainly not unconditionally elected to become a Nevadan. How does then one become a Nevadan? Well, he becomes a Nevadan, by meeting the CONDITIONS set forth.

God has ordained the condition of faith, for it is he who wrote that one is justified by faith. God justifies a person the same way any judge justifies anyone: when they meet the conditions. It just happens to be that God's condition is faith. There are plenty of Scriptures that state that.

Here, allow me to help you out...

No!

Let that soak in a little bit.

Now please humbly receive my correction. What you have is a passive voice transitive verb. Only action verbs can be transitive. The verb is not "being". "Being" is a helping verb. The verb is "justified." "To be" verbs are used in conjunction with action verbs to make it passive.

You have come a long way from someone who use to care about what Scripture state to having a total disregard towards it.

And to demonstrate how depraved your rationalization is, allow me to make another comment:

Even if your gross grammar were correct, it still does nothing to prove the fact that the scripture state that one is justified by faith not by election.

So we agree on something.

I doubt you despising me is any more justified, really.

Longing for revival wrote:
Weapon, excellent idea! I am going to do the same. May God grant us His boundless grace and endeserved mercy as we seek Him. I hope others will do the same. One other suggestion; let's lay aside our animosity, anger, pride, and contentious spirits for the week also, and let's see what God can do!

I think I will write them down and meditate on these for the next week and see what it does.

I believe we can have national revival as in times past. There are some that do not believe this because they believe that only an elect few can go to heaven.

Discerning Believer wrote:
If our faith was the justifier, then we would be the author of our salvation and not God.

Romans 5:1 wrote:
Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:

Murray wrote:
Has [sic!] JD and Yamil got their 'bible' commentary printed yet for xmas or is it only here online at sermonaudio?

Longing for revival wrote:
22 hours of bantering and bickering and not one reply to the need for revival!

To answer your question, one is declared righteous based on Jesus's righteous.

(So I guess, Murray's ad hominem's have been proven wrong again)

Now I wonder if you are as quick to answer my question.

According to the pole question (faith alone) one is either justified by faith or justified by election. Which one do you fit in?

Discerning Believer wrote:
There is none that seeketh after God, except Yamil.

R.K. Borill wrote:
You see Yamil, William Cowper unlike you had the correct understanding of the power of sin over human nature.

BTW,

JD is right. We need to stay on the topic. I have made the argument that justification is by faith. The Calvinist makes the argument that justification is by election.

R. K. Borill wrote:
Are not both used by the Lord?

If you cannot tell the difference between CANNOT and WILL NOT, then there is nothing much I can do for you other than buy you a dictionary for Christmas and hope that that would enlighten you a little bit.

R. K. Borill wrote:
Christ must break the power of sin before they are willing to come to him. Otherwise, they are UNWILLING and THEY CANNOT.

DB wrote:
They claim that bondage really does not mean bondage and that they are not so bound up that they can't free themselves from it.

My first graders understand that CAN NOT is not synonymous to WILL NOT.

R. K. Borill wrote:
It always comes back down to ad homenim arguments with you Yamil.

Secondly, it's also about the points I made that you completely ignored and are only crying foul play after quickly discovering that your position is scripturally bankrupt.

Besides, unless you have repented of it, it seems that you enjoy dishing out ad hominems. You even bragged about it stating that Jesus did it, and so should you.

R. K. Borill wrote:
t is not a volition that does not work. It is a volition that refuses and will not believe the truth.

R. K. Borill wrote:
It is not the Calvinist that says this, it is the Word of God.