Discerning Believer wrote:
JD,
How can it be by grace and by faith at the same time.

Discerning Believer wrote:
Question is, Is faith the grounds of justification? Is it what causes God to justify us, or is it the means by which we believe on that justification already provided?

Joel Beeke wrote:
It is critical to note that nowhere in Scripture is faith (or any other grace) represented as constituting some ground of merit for justification.

ML wrote:
Justification is by faith, but not as you understand it... the answer you are looking for is "Yes".

ML wrote:
Faith is not the grounds of our justification.

Romans 1:17 and 3:22 makes it very clear that faith is the basis of justification.

Now moving on. By choosing faith over unconditional election you have just confessed that one is justified NOT because he has been unconditionally elected but rather that he has exercised faith.

Discerning Believer wrote:
Yamil,
It is only a rabbit trail when it exposes your false doctrines of man-centered salvation.

I apologize for missing your question.

DB wrote:
DB: "...declares one to be righteous". Based on what, something you do or in something that has already been done by someone else, ie. Jesus Christ?

Do you believe that justification is by faith or unconditional election?

Now please, just as I gave you a simple straightforward answer, I would appreciate a straightforward answer from you.

Discerning Believer wrote:
JD, Yamil,
When you live in a world of sin and darkness, the last thing you want is to have your sins exposed....

Discerning Believer wrote:
Yamil, you are being very dishonest by not posting the entire paragraph.

Discerning Believer wrote:
Basically your premise is that salvation is all a work of man and none of God.

God is the one that gave us the cognizant ability.
God is the one that requires us to use it.
God is the one that provides the choice.

So again you are creating a pseudo-argument.

Scripture also states that God will draw all men unto him. So it is obvious that from God's perspective everyone has that cognizant ability.

Discerning Believer wrote:
Wrong Yamil, no insinuation that a saved man can change his heart. It is not his job, it is God's job.

Discerning Believer wrote:
If a lost man will not turn to God, what has to happen to his will. God has to sovereignly intervene to make him willing.

Discerning Believer wrote:
The natural man will not repent because he loves his sin and is perfectly content to stay in it.

Sotourne wrote:
Yep We can see now why he calls himself the Instructor of the papist Mass!!
What is described above is the Roman dogma heresy. Clearly we have in this "Weapon of Popish Instruction" - just another poor heretical papist churning out salvation by works. The only difference is that he travels incognito!!
Satan's disinformation is still as subtle as ever, but remains as dangerous a deception as always.
The sad thing about all this is that like the church in Matt 7:21-23, they actually believe they are believers.
2Pet2.2 "And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of."

Discerning Believer wrote:
If I am wrong, then will you admit.
1. The natural man is unable by his own power to change his heart.
2. The natural man is unable without the power of God to repent.
3. The natural man is unable by his own pwer to turn to God.

1. You insinuate that somehow the saved man can. The saved man cannot change his heart neither. Sanctification is a lifetime process. The change of heart does not come before salvation, but after salvation.

2. Repentance is a cognizant ability, not a supernatural act. Your version of repentance cannot be found in the Bible, let alone anywhere outside your Calvinistic theology. There is no such thing as a carnal pizza and a spiritual pizza.

BTW, the Weapon of Mass Instruction does not celebrate Christmas. He celebrates Hannukah, although I do not make a big fuss over those that do since the Lord gives us liberty.

ML wrote:
Justification is by faith alone.. after all "Sola Fide" is one of the key Reformation mottos .. the problem is not with this assertion.. the problem is with you guys who want to assert "free will" at every given opportunity and thus who want to make "by faith" mean on the grounds of faith!

Or maybe it's just another of the worn out straw man. Yea, I think that's what it is.

So tell me, is justification by faith or unconditional election?

R. K. Borill wrote:
What you are saying may be true about the past, but from my experience, I am not allowed consecutive posts even if I attempt to do it under an alias. I am a Calvinist. Therefore, whatever they have done in policy is being consistently applied. You are not being singled out.

R. K. Borill wrote:
Oh, most gracious Yamil who gives when we ask, and we have not because we have not asked you.
Now we are asking because you have rebuked us as we deserve. Please tell us when we "thumb-sucking Calvinists" cried foul or whined when you gave out your "straightforward answers". You have rightly withheld the cheese when we have whined.
We know that "it is within your nature to give us truth" even though the Almighty said in his Word: "Let God be true and every man a liar"! That being the case we yet know that you will tell us truthfully.