BTW i acidentaly posted last night in the wrong subject sorry everyone

John UK wrote:
Are you saying, Charles, that God afflicted Job without a cause? Just because he felt like it?

I have to remind you John that I dont know the mind of God its hugely flattering but Im afraid I dont deserve it.

God does nothing without a cause.

Why did He afflict Job ? I dont know maybe for our edification and education Whatever it was for a Good cause to a Good end because our God is Good.

As for John 9 yes ive heard this one used before to infer the ignorance of the disciples to the teachings of Job.
which is a shame, why do people today often think they are better or know more than people of old. Given the Jews were bought up with the law

I believe that in that time it was a legitamate question. blindness in the OT time WAS FREQUENTLY a result of the parents sexual sin as babies with
syphilis are often born blind and syphilis was widespread and incurable.

Neverth less, The man was blind for the glory of God so that he might be healed at an ordained time and place by Jesus that we know cos it says so but we dont know that the disciples were ignorant lapdogs of the pharisees

Simple see, we (you) dont have to put ill informed labels on people (and defame the name of Calvin) its a simple matter of applying basic scripture

Ok see that ? Lets see how you deal with that question, every time we confess our faith to the lost is an examination of our doctrine it must be consistent and watertight as it is in the Word, I want to see what youve got.
No more second hand jive what do YOU say ?

Jer. 5:11 The house of Israel and the house of Judah have been utterly unfaithful to me," declares the LORD. 12They have lied about the LORD; they said, "He will do nothing! No harm will come to us; we will never see sword or famine. 13The prophets are but wind and the word is not in them; so let what they say be done to them."

more natural disasters i guess

Mike wrote:
Bad stuff happens. Decay set in at the fall. Earthquakes happen because plates shift because the earth is decaying. God doesn't have to say, "Hmmm, I think I'll smack Haiti today." The continual calling of every natural disaster God's specific wrath is silly. When a tornado tears through some poor folks trailer park, is that God's judgment on them? Please.

Yeah ? 'great comment Mike '

Job 9v55
It is God who removes the mountains, they know not how, When He overturns them in His anger who shakes the earth out of its place, And its pillars tremble;

Psalm 18v7
Then the earth shook and trembled; the foundations also of the hills moved and were shaken, because he was wroth

Isiah 30v30
The LORD will cause men to hear his majestic voice and will make them see his arm coming down with raging anger and consuming fire, with cloudburst, thunderstorm and hail

Isiah 51v6
Lift up your eyes to the heavens, look at the earth beneath; the heavens will vanish like smoke, the earth will wear out like a garment and its inhabitants die like flies. But my salvation will last forever, my righteousness will never fail.

etc etc etc ad infinitum in His Holy Word

Praise God that He has revealed his awesome power and judgement in ridding the world of thousands of witches and demon worshippers in Haiti. He has humbled and punished the filtyhy nation of Haiti.
He hasnt forgotten His people, even tho the world tolerates and applauds nations like this including the filthy pederast sex tourist hell hole in indonesia wiped out by a tsunami and its rebellious inhabitants and their european fellow travellers receiving the grave of an ass, evenn theo the world loves these places God is revealing that He wont accept them
Real christians should be thanking God for His warnings to the world in punishing Haiti - will they listen ?

I understand the tribulation period to be a physical judgement upon the earthdwellers, note, this takes nothing away from the present tribulation of the saints, only that the period of tribulation will be special and distinct and much greater magnitude as Jesus said there will have been nothing like it before nor ever again.
Thus I can accomodate your theology within it because at the end of this period Jesus comes to rule and the day of judgement is either at this time or at the end of the millenia during which period there will be a restored healed earth but after the judgement at the end of the millenia will be the new heavans and earth.
Im not sure about everything thing after the tribulation but i do feel sure that there will be a time of special judgement upon the earth and the elect living will be removed before according to biblical precedent.
The start of this period will be a total suprise to nonbelievers but the elect should be watching and alert and not unprepared, the elect jews left jerusalem en masse before the romans arrived for example and were spared.

this takes nothing away from the tribulation and persecution of the elect in the past and present day but its clear as day surely that the whole earth is going to be destroyed and prior to that a time of wickedness and judgement EVEN worse than the flood ! The mind boggles. This is a time of special judgemnt and general condemnation upon the world punishment for unbelievers much more severe than anything the world has known except for the flood. We are not appointed for wrath and I would be very suprisede if the elect as a body were to enter this period.