The Bible Society has reported a growing demand for copies of the Bible in China where an estimated 500,000 people converted to Christianity in 2009 alone.
Although some four million Bibles were printed and distributed across China last year, the rapid growth of the church year on year means that demand for Bibles is now outstripping supply, according to the Bible Society.
The official number of Christians in China stands at 28.6 million, but it is believed the true figure could be as high as 90 million if the estimated number of worshippers at unofficial house churches is included....
If the "Bibles" in China are printed off at STATE-OWNED printers then they cannot be accurate publications! It figures that such a naively written article would come from "Christianity Today"--perhaps thee most liberal "christian" publication on the planet. I very much doubt the statistics they quote as well; one cannot incude the membership numbers of the state-ruled church as true born again converts; it is the underground church which holds the true converts to Christ. It is precisely because they hold fast to the teachings of Christ that the state church and state system will not tolerate them!
No, PC, the Chinese wouldn't want a Bible translated from a barbarian tongue such as English. It is good to read though, that one of the oldest Bibles around and in use in China was taken from the ERV, and not the power hungry Anglicans of the 17th century who were paid off with money and positions for their work Hmmm, for some reason this reminds of a rather good article on Wikipedia about, [URL=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Authorized_King_James_Version]]]Authorized King James Version[/URL].
In any case one should be smuggling in CDs with such programs from [URL=http://www.crosswire.org/index.jsp]]]The CrossWire Bible Society[/URL], which, yes, they do put on the KJV as the Bible in their starter program. Somewhat old fashion to be using printed Bibles, but the Chinese could run some off on their own printers, if there are the "touchy feely" types who need it in that form.
Guinness wrote: A long overdue admission by the Bible Society. The background to this is that the Bible Society in collaboration with the stooge official Chinese religious bodies jointly declared in 1993 that "the era of bible smuggling is over". I wrote in protest to them at the time, that even by their OWN statistics it would take well over one hundred years to get a Bible to every Christian in China. Their reply was mealy mouthed drivel. Shame on them for their deceit! Shame on them for their assisting the Chinese government propaganda and government control and restricting of the printing and distribution of Bibles. This leads to increased surveillance of the Christians in China and increased persuction.
Thank you Guinness, I see you are well acquainted with the subterfuge, and I thank you for the info. It pays to get clued up on these charlatans who cuddle up to governments and portray untruths to the world. Gov oppression of vital Christianity will always take place in communistic and atheistic countries.
Of course, 'religion' is fine for such, which is why I believe that modern versions are being thrust on an unsuspecting public; eventually there will no sound doctrine left in these 'Bibles'.
btw that quote from 1cor 1 Corinthians 2 14 But a natural man does not accept the things of the Spirit of God; for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually appraised.---NASB
in the KJ that last word is 'discerned'
which seems better to me because ' apparaised ' suggests some natural faculty on the part of the reader or hearer to evaluate what he has heard and find the truth whereas the bible teaches that we are given to understand as a gift
it may be a small point but i find these things all the time with non AV texts
John UK wrote: It makes me sick, to be honest. How any Christian can justify these money grubbers is beyond me. And because they are filthy lucreists, filling their coffers with pots of gold, they can become oppressors and steal the market, simply by their lies and subterfuge and claims, winning the propaganda battle through the media, and filling this world up with Bibles which I wouldn't give tuppence for. Has no-one ever wondered how the Alpha Course came to be so big and international? Subterfuge and counterfeit Christianity!! Praise God for grace to see it.
FYI - you quoted Neil on the fact that the Bible version used by the Bible Society / Amity Press is public domain.
Thus, the bible version debate has absolutely NOTHING to do with whether they are "money grubbers" or "filthy lucreists".
The issue is indeed the "PROPAGANDA BATTLE" where the Bible Society are in active, self-confessed, league with the Communist Chinese authorities.
Please see my post on 20th February for a brief timeline of this charade.
Neil wrote: Info on Chinese Bibles is easily found for those who take the trouble: [URL=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_Union_Version]]]Chinese Union Version[/URL] seems to be the oldest Chinese Prot. Bible in widespread use, & is public domain. Unsurprisingly to me, the ERV was used as its basis, not the KJV.
Precisely Neil. The year 1881 was a big one for the devil, when his willing slaves, by subterfuge and evil strategy began the multiplication of totally unnecessary Bible versions in English, when scholars OUGHT to have been trying to supply the two and one half thousand language groups in this world with their VERY FIRST Bible!!
It makes me sick, to be honest.
How any Christian can justify these money grubbers is beyond me.
And because they are filthy lucreists, filling their coffers with pots of gold, they can become oppressors and steal the market, simply by their lies and subterfuge and claims, winning the propaganda battle through the media, and filling this world up with Bibles which I wouldn't give tuppence for.
Has no-one ever wondered how the Alpha Course came to be so big and international? Subterfuge and counterfeit Christianity!!
Info on Chinese Bibles is easily found for those who take the trouble: [URL=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_Union_Version]]]Chinese Union Version[/URL] seems to be the oldest Chinese Prot. Bible in widespread use, & is public domain. Unsurprisingly to me, the ERV was used as its basis, not the KJV.
Moderator Alpha, is correct. The neither [A]nglican [V]ersion nor the [URL=http://www.lockman.org/nasb/nasbcmp.php]]]NASB[/URL] have anything to do with this topic, since most Chinese --guess-- read and write Manderin Chinese. They have absolutely no interest in what version of the Bible Anglophiles prefer. I assume all they want is an accurate version. I'm not sure what free electronic versions of the Chinese Bible such places as [URL=http://www.crosswire.org/index.jsp]]]The CrossWire Bible Society[/URL] uses but I even suspect they might be based on the AV! They have a wide choice of contemporary English Bibles to choose from such as the NET and ESV, to help them learn contemporary English, and for history majors there are copies of the AV, Geneva, etc. if they happen to be interested in modern early English.
I would just hope they can get material from the such places as [URL=http://www.crosswire.org/index.jsp]]]The CrossWire Bible Society[/URL] because China is a Communist dictatorship.
However, with this particular thread it really has nothing to do with English versions of the Bible!
John UK wrote: There is more to this than meets the eye, Charles.
oh yes totally john, i was googling the (1593 ?) act of settlement today and came across the blog of archbishop cranmer quite interesting vis our discusions on anglicanism
i didnt find the act of settlement btw, the one where the queen promises to furthur the gospel ? If you find it can you give me the link ? Id like to print it on my special color printer and put it up in the house also the shorter WCF
As usually happens, the topic of this news article (with the word "bible" in the title) has been lost and the version debate has hijacked the thread. It is not SermonAudio's purpose to prohibit a civil discussion about bible versions in this forum. We simply ask that the discussion take place in a survey appropriate for the discussion.
This news article thread will not be closed at this time nor will any comments be removed at this time but, please, for the sake of our many users who expect to read comments relevant to the news article, continue the version discussion in an appropriate survey.
There are basically three view points on versions...one indeed is: 'all versions of the Bible are really the same'.
Rather than engage in a lengthy debate, I offer the following excellent article from the Trinitarian Bible Society which deals with those three viewpoints.
[URL=http://www.trinitarianbiblesociety.org/site/articles/A121.pdf]]]Which Bible Version Does it REALLY matter?[/URL]
There is an Iranian Brother who was made to memorize the Zoroastrian sacred book of Avesta and the Quran, who then came from Iran as a teenager and was gloriously converted and now a Pastor of a Reformed Baptist Church in Cheltenham. He is also involved in work on the Farsi Bible with the TBS and has the Gospel of Christ Persian Radio ministry here [URL=http://www.injilefarsi.com/ ]]]Here[/URL] How is it that a young man with English as his second language, can be so convicted to use a supposed archaic and difficult to read authorised version? It certainly destroys one myth about the readability of that version!
O yes folk usually say- but it is better to read the original languages
Mike wrote: The use of silly evolutionist arguments to uphold your point of view is, um, interesting. The enemy of your enemy is your friend?
Mmmm...upholding my point of view?
Why do you not abandon your NASB and go for the ESV as most evangelicals are heading that way?
What do you say about those modern versionists seeing the need for one bible then?
[URL=http://www.desiringgod.org/ResourceLibrary/Articles/ByDate/2004/1534_Good_English_With_Minimal_Translation_Why_Bethlehem_Uses_the_ESV/]]]Piper and the ESV[/URL]
What do you say about the General Editor of the ESV J I Packer[URL=http://www.takeheed.net/Take_Heed_2010/Current_Concerns/Jan_2010/Packer_and_Mother_Teresa.htm]]]Revising his own book?[/URL]
I know why I won't be buying an ESV.
Tell me why there shouldn't be ONE BIBLE version for the English speaking world? Why does the NASB have GOD in I Timothy 3: 16 and the ESV doesn't? Which is MORE accurate? Isn't that what it is all about..the most accurate version?
Why did Pastors abandon the AV and go for the NIV and now agree that the NIV is a poor translation..so they promote the ESV? Where is your discernment brother?
Why do we need several versions and not ONE? You don't see the problem mmmm
There is more to this than meets the eye, Charles.
Far, far TOO MUCH MONEY is being made by so-called Christians in this world in the realm of Bible versions.
This is why I so respect the Trinitarian Bible Society, who have a genuine concern for souls. Too many of the others are out for gain...
But godliness with contentment is great gain. For we brought nothing into this world, and it is certain we can carry nothing out. And having food and raiment let us be therewith content. But they that will be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and into many foolish and hurtful lusts, which drown men in destruction and perdition. For the love of money is the root of all evil: which while some coveted after, they have erred from the faith, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows. But thou, O man of God, flee these things; and follow after righteousness, godliness, faith, love, patience, meekness. Fight the good fight of faith, lay hold on eternal life, whereunto thou art also called, and hast professed a good profession before many witnesses. 1 Timothy 6:6-12 KJV
John UK wrote: Far be it from me to confuse any eternal soul with arguments produced by filthy lucreists, whose only desire is to sell more books and make more profit. $$$$$¬£¬£¬£¬£¬£¬£¬£¬£¬£¬£
steady on john dear boy
still and all it is heartbreaking to experience the universal acceptance of the NIV its inescapable.......or is it ?..............have i missed the obvious ? have i missed the wood for the trees ?......I know this may seem bizarre but what about the anglicans ? surely they might be expected to use the KJ ?
Actually Jim, I'm well aware that there are those schismatics who do not believe the KJV to be the best translation today.
Trouble is, these same folks do not reckon ANY Bible can be considered a good enough version to be used in isolation as an extremely accurate version.
Trouble is, these money-grubbers want ME to buy a half-dozen versions, thus filling their coffers, because they reckon with a half-dozen versions I ought to be able to approximate a decent Bible between them.
And so I have to waste my time poring over six versions, and even then I may not the correct text.
On the other hand, whenever I speak to people about GOD'S WORD and GOD'S MESSAGE, I tell them it is found in GOD'S HOLY BIBLE, the Authorized Version of 1611, and that this Bible can be trusted to show them the truth.
Far be it from me to confuse any eternal soul with arguments produced by filthy lucreists, whose only desire is to sell more books and make more profit. $$$$$¬£¬£¬£¬£¬£¬£¬£¬£¬£¬£
You waste your time on me Jim, coz I'm one of those rare saints who can still be called a BIBLE-BELIEVER. It is only the Lord can convince you also.
Actually, John U K., again, [URL=http://www.bible.org/page.php?page_id=665]]]Why I Do Not Think the King James Bible Is the Best Translation Available Today[/URL], is well worth reading. Oh, and blood you say? [URL=http://www.raptureme.com/rr-kjvo.html]]]King James Onlyism[/URL] If the Chinese would bother to read anything in English it would of course be in contemporary English,
1 Corinthians 14 [URL=http://www.bible.org/page.php?page_id=665]]]Why I Do Not Think the King James Bible Is the Best Translation Available Today[/URL]
But what I know of the Chinese language, word for word translation would be impossible from --any-- Bible including Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek, to Chinese. It would have to be dynamic equivalence, and of course most Chinese would not even read a Bible in the "Barbarian" tongue such as English.
Jim Lincoln wrote: But again, there is no reason to used a version of the Bible in contemporary English, even such as the American King James Version, even though it has flawed sources, at least it is understandable...
I sure hope the poor Chinese brethren do not get inundated with 'Bible' versions like the west has. Such confusion, such a satanic attack on faith in God's word, so many schisms, such division between brethren, such an ecumenical wile, a devilish scheme to destroy the church, an arminist strategy to snuff out the biblical doctrines of grace, such anti-Trinitarian, anti-Blood, anti-Hell, anti-Wrath, anti-Faith etc etc.