John UK wrote: Good evening Candle Lit Ah, I can see I will have to move back to England, where the people have more dosh, and speak proper. Plus, great news! I'm going to have my own website! Oh deep joy! To put my paintings up on the internet, great fun! Yes I believe what you say about John 20:22, and that it was not the time for them to receive the Comforter, which would be with them permanently, the presence of the wonderful Lord Jesus in the soul. In my dictionary a prolepsis is 'a rhetorical device by which objections are anticipated and answered in advance'. And the cure for it is plenty of carrot juice and barley grass.
That's great, John. Your own website to display your paintings - that's good marketing! I look forward to seeing it.
I love your definition of "prolepsis." I think the cure will work!
Don't want to keep you up, John. Have a restful night of sleep. God bless.
Sorry that you didn't sell anything at the market today. Next time.
John, the discussion has mentioned John 20:22 where Jesus breathed on the disciples, and said "Receive ye the Holy Ghost: " Since this was before His ascension, don't you think this was as occurred in the OT where the Spirit of the Lord came upon people to empower them to do the work that He had for them to do? I've never heard of 'prolepsis' and it isn't in Webster's Dictionary. Maybe it is a derivative of 'prolapse' as Charles mentioned in his post. Must be a theological concept?
prince charles wrote: i dont think there is anything new age aboutt this watson chap if thats what you are thinking, DJC has disapearde for a bit i expect he is vacuuming the leaves from his pool ?
Don't know Watson and haven't followed the posts closely. DJ mentioned Watson referencing Riplinger, then the discussion with John UK, went in that direction. I picked up on the New Age part and ran with it. Perhaps it was another tangent, deviating from the objective of the discussion.
I'm leaving to meet a dear sister in the Lord for our weekly lunch. Fellowship and food, good combination.
prince charles wrote: hi candleit, 'utter lack of facticity ' more evidence of DJC's calling as we suspect ! so we know he is a retired lawyer, has a condo in florida with a pool and palm trees, there cant be many people answering that description, reckon we can pay him a suprise visit !
Yep, that seals it. Definitely a lawyer. If we don't catch him basking in the sun by the pool, I've heard he frequents a nearby coffee house. __________
Concerning the discussion of the New Age . . .I spent some time reading material on that in the '80's. It's good to know its pervasive and insidious infiltration into Western culture. There is nothing "new" about it. It began with Satan't lie in the Garden. It is only "new" to Western Judeo Christian culture.
When I called on doctors, in America, but from India, they smiled a knowing smile when I presented them materials by my company which promoted visualization, meditation, etc.
As a Christian, I did not want to promote the New Age, and I was well aware of what was being communicated through the printed and recorded promotional items that I was required to distribute.
I think it is best to know what is TRUE - God's Word - then, we won't be taken in by the counterfeit.
sanctified humour wrote: Phil Johnson is well known for his sense of humour-his comments are interesting re: Spurgeon and sanctified humour. If it is appropriate/not offensive- has it a place in our fellowship here?
Sorry, I failed to give an answer to your MOST important question regarding humour - YES, humour (sanctified?) is absolutely necessary in life, and should most definitely show up on these boards. Life would be boring without it. It is surely a gift of God to lighten the gravity of life. So, LET THE HUMOUR BEGIN ....
sanctified humour wrote: Having followed calvinist topic posts over the years-probably DJC49 is one of the few truly zealous Calvinists still posting from that time in defence of the true gospel. DJC49 is often critiqued for his own sarcasm-but it is simply good humoured and never offensive. Phil Johnson is well known for his sense of humour-his comments are interesting re: Spurgeon and sanctified humour. If it is appropriate/not offensive- has it a place in our fellowship here?
Hey, you won't find anyone who finds the humor in language more than I do!
Once I was initiated into the SA fraternity, thoroughly raked over the coals, it was the comments of a couple of posters who kept me reading. One of those was DJC. I like his sarcasm, because it makes a point without being malicious. But, more importantly, it is his Biblical knowledge combined with analytical ability to see the weakness in an argument and to take it apart while clearly presenting what Scripture says that makes a compelling argument.
Don't know PJ; however, Spurgeon has been a constant companion of mine for years. I know him through his writings. p.s. My grandfather was named Charles Spurgeon (first and middle). No flesh and blood relation.
prince charles wrote: yes DJC can be a crusty soul !i imagine him as an early retired lawyer - something you raised recently can christians have an evil spirit within them ? i would say yes. quite a bit to think about how careful we need to be about influences
You have an active imagination concerning DJC and his glittering pool and palm trees You may be right about lawyering - who uses a word like "non sequitur" except maybe a lawyer? Probably not a dentist.
Now, I have to clear up for you what I was saying concerning a Christian having a spirit other than the HS. NO - a Christian CANNOT have an evil spirit. Light and darkness do not dwell together.
What has been FALSE teaching is that a Christian can have both a CARNAL spirit and the HOLY SPIRIT. This is a LIE. One pastor who does not flinch on calling this heretical is AL MARTIN. He is on SA. Please listen to his message concerning the so-called "carnal christian." As a matter of fact, Charles, LISTEN to as many of his messages as you have time. He is SOUND in his teaching and will not lead you astray. You are right concerning the importance of influences in your life.
Also, DJC, addressed your post very well. Listen to him. He is very discerning.
prince charles wrote: thx candlit i did mention your yesterday post which i enjoyed i should just point out that i didnt say that christians in the west were joyful because of their comfort it was more a question really as to what degree the idea of christian joy has been affected by relative temporal comfort on the way home i stopped off and met some friends for a go karting race and i won a bottle of beer which was first prize !
Yeah, I knew that your question was more rhetorical than anything, but give me a intro and I'll go off on a tangent. I've learned NOT to do that with DJC. He really gets upset if you use his comment for a springboard. He wants it received as delivered, and don't use it to go elsewhere.
What is your job? I must have missed that post. I only know that you work on a ship.
First prize. . .sounds like you had fun.
Speaking of "low" - there was a poster today called "where is the zeal" who put a real damper on things. I wonder where his zeal is?
I think he thinks the "chatter" such as this is not worthy of these boards.
Back on the topic of JOY - I was reading in my NASB (don't tell John, but it actually says the same thing as the KJV, just different wording ) Chapter 15 Jesus is saying that He is the Vine and the disciples(we) are the branches. He is talking about abiding in Him, and His Words abiding in the disciples(us), and them(us) bearing much FRUIT by doing so - about keeping His commmandments and abiding in His love - then this: "These things have I spoken unto you, that MY JOY might remain in you, and that YOUR JOY MIGHT BE FULL." verse 11
Now, as we know from Galations 5:22 the FRUIT of the Spirit is: Love, JOY, peace, patience, goodness, kindness, gentleness, faithfulness, and self-control. Out of LOVE flows these expressions, JOY being listed first. So, JOY is definitely a manifestation of the new birth in Christ, and as there are Christians EVERYWHERE in the world, this JOY would be in them manifested in their particular situations - be it a surrounding of material poverty, or of material wealth, or illness or health, or otherwise. Just wanted to share my thoughts on that.
prince charles wrote: ha ha ! i was better looking back
Good morning, Charles,
I wanted to clarify a post that I sent yesterday regarding your post about Western culture and that of Christians in the West and their joy being based on a certain comfort level compared to say the "Dalits" of India, or some group in Burma that I am not familiar with. It is good NOT to generalize about people. Having said that, I fall into that way too often.
My point in my post of yesterday was that from personal experience, the joy of a Christian is not necessarily affected by outward or even inward circumstances. Sometimes, the greatest joy is in the midst of trial. The real evidence of geniune joy is DURING the trials and tribulations. And, I am defining joy as that inward rest of the soul in the Saviour that buoys the spirit above the circumstances, and is not necessarily an exuberant spirit, but a settled contentment. "Man is born for trouble as the sparks fly upward" and everyone has their own - the troubles of some are just more obvious than others. Western culture is goood at masking emotions.
- glad to see that you are back to your "chipper" self this morning.
John UK wrote: #2 No! The devil is a spirit, but not omnipresent, and indwells no-one, even though he works on hearts, only some of his devils possess some of the ungodly.
#4 Weeell.... what about this spirit which is born within us by the Spirit, which is the second birth?
It will get deeper now, eh?
John, #2 Sorry, I wasn't clear. I was referring to the "spirit that worketh in the children of disobedience" but, not indwelling them.
I have observed people whose demeanor and countenance changed so drastically, and their words and actions were such that it could be said that person was manifesting the presence of an evil spirit.
I do not talk about spirits with people in the churches that I would attend. They would be clueless. I am not charismatic. There was one church, mainstream protestant, where the leadership sent out a fact finding team to check out that "holy laughter" movement, with the intention of "getting all they could get." These are people who wouldn't think of talking about "spirits." I couldn't believe my ears. Now, that distressed me.
Yes, interesting posts from your exchanges with DJC. I'm interested to see how that discussion mentioned in #4 unfolds.
You mentioned being a soldier. From my observation, the hard work of soldiering includes getting in shape and being prepared. Being engaged in battle, the soldier is doing what he has been equipped to do, and seems to do it very well. Down time, after one is in shape and before the battle, seems to be the time of real testing - times of ease, times when one gets soft.
I think this holds in our Christian walk. The battle often brings out the best in us. The KEY is being prepared - daily discipline, intake of the word, prayer, being vigilent. Our faith is strengthened when pass the test - it is a proven faith - not to God - but, to us.
I think day to day living - the times where we aren't being challenged - when things are easy - sin creeps in every so slyly. And, sin robs us of our joy. There is the "book of wars" -referred to somewhere in the OT - it would appear that men were meant to do battle.
As Christians we war not against flesh and blood, but against principalities and powers - the forces of darkness. But, we must remember, the battle is the LORD's. He is a sure Victor! And, we are victorious in HIM!
Well, that's my "preaching" for the day. We are not in Church, so I am not violating Scripture.
John UK wrote: But they shook off the dust of their feet against them, and came unto Iconium. And the disciples were FILLED with JOY, and WITH the HOLY GHOST. Acts 13:47-52 KJV The big test of 'joy' is under persecution or difficulty. An imagined 'biblical' joy will collapse, whereas true HOLY GHOST JOY will continue no matter what happens.
I love that - "they shook off the dust of their feet - and, they were FILLED with JOY and with the HOLY GHOST." ________
John, I also love this discussion on the Spirit. I was reading in Eph. 2:1,2 where it says, "And you hath He quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins: wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience."
Now, we Believers have been given the Holy Spirit, but the ungodly have the spirit of Satan - father of lies, and disobedience. Now, my question: As Believers, we have "one spirit" - that of the Holy Spirit - right? We have His indwelling presence. We don't have a separate spirit from within making war with the Holy Spirit, do we?
Wow, Charles, hardly enough space to answer all your questions.
Personal testimony: I have known suffering, illness and death of many family members, and personal suffering in my own health. I have known a lack of material goods as well as abundance, persecution for my faith, loss of friendship because of my faith and envy of a lifestyle, loneliness, misunderstanding, and I could go on. All that one sees, and thinks to be is not so. Looking at a person, where they live, how they live, cannot possibly tell you what goes on within. I can tell you there are many things worse than lack of material goods. "With increased wisdom comes increased pain." I know what that means, but I also know this joy of the Lord that I have, others have even been jealous of. It comes as a peace that all is right with my soul and God, no matter the circumstances.
The only thing that can cause me to lose my joy is sin. I have known that as well, and there is nothing in the world that I would exchange for the joy that I have in Christ.
Now, I have to correct myself on a previous post: See Hebrews 12:1,2 "...let us run with patience the race that is set before us, LOOKING unto JESUS the author and finisher of our faith; who for the JOY that was set before Him endured the cross, . .
'tis a monopoly wrote: I recall getting out of bed on a red hot summers day in a grumbling mood-too much to do and not enough time. After achieving some things I was still grumbling to my children when I had to take them with me to buy a garden pot from a local garden centre. Grumbling that I was "hot" as I looked I sighted one on a high shelf-a nice big pot. On my tip toes I managed to reach it-only it sort of fell-on my head. I wasn't to know it was full of ice cold water! I was completely drenched to the amusement of the children and all the other shoppers. I burst out laughing and how we did laugh-pompous ego deflated-the Lord dealing with my grumbling and being "hot" in a humorous way?
Laughter is good medicine. You made me laugh! Thanks for sharing!
prince charles wrote: How can one be joyful in this life when we know that the real joy is to come ? How can we be joyful when our neighbours and almost everyone we know will perish since we ourselves will barely be saved ?
Those are good questions, Charles.
I'd have to say that true joy is a gift given to all Christians, and some seem to reside in it more than others. Our joy will be a reflection of our walk with the Lord. It is a Christian discipline to "keep our eyes FIXED on the race that is before us" - that means with single purpose (like the retriever headed for the water) staying the course - not being distracted by superfluous stuff such as media coverage of an item - True joy is the abiding presence of the Lord - knowing that all our sins have been paid for, that we are free from the penalty of death, that all is well with our souls, that we have a future.
As to others and their eternal condition - that is the bitter that goes with the sweet. I grieve over the lost, which prompts me to pray for their salvation. OTOH, the Sovereignty of God gives me great comfort. He is the Architect. What may look like demolition to me, is the process of HIM building His Kingdom.
Corgis, savage? How so? Our retrievers, anything bad? I don't remember anything bad. They were gentle with children, energetic, and amiable.
There are only a few breeds of dogs that I absolutely will not have anything to do with - the pit bull, and rottweiller (sp?) - just don't trust them.
Retrievers are the best! In your post this morning to DJ, you were asking about joy. I'm going off on a tangent, but here goes: On that trip to Greece, that I mentioned in a previous post, we were on the island of Rhodes, in the old section. There was a little inlet of water that I was sitting by, when I turned to see this black retriever rounding a corner of a building, crossing the street, and with single point of purpose, headed straight for that little inlet of water. He jumped in the clear water with the light colored sand and frolicked with such gaiety that I find myself smiling every time that I remember that scene. It would seem that even animals have a certain joy.
Oh, I'm enjoying those exchanges that John and DJC are having. They are excellent to think on.