CAB wrote:
And if the rich young ruler came to ask Jesus how to be saved, are you saying Jesus lied to him when he commended him for obeying the commandments, and gave him wrong advice when he said to sell all he had and come follow him?
If the true answer was "NOTHING," why didn't Jesus SAY that?
The answer is because God wants EVERYTHING. And the rich young ruler was not willing at that time to give up all he had because the Bible said he "had much possessions."

From the beginning of this encounter, Jesus knew that the rich young ruler didn't even have the proper understanding of what "Good" was! The rich young ruler had a superficial concept of the commandments. Jesus knew that this rich young ruler needed to be "stripped naked" (especially of his coveting riches), and in order to find out what REAL perfection was in keeping all the Law, Jesus told him to follow Him.

Eternal life is for those who PERFECTLY keep the Law!

CAB wrote:
It's referring to Psalm 41:9 --
109:5-8 is not messianic.

CAB wrote:
Psalm 109 is not messianic. John 6:7 Jesus said "one of you is a devil" a year before his crucifixion.

Scripture disagrees with you, CAB!

Now please read Acts 1:16-20

CAB wrote:
[snip]... We did get to talk about two parables, the parable of the Ten Virgins and the Parable of the Sower, both examples of saved people who became lost. [snip]

You, however, conveniently turned it into an allegory to support your belief that one can lose his salvation.

Please understand that parables were given to illustrate ONE main point, CAB. The point of the 10 virgin parable was that we should BE READY and persevere in faith. It was NOT given by Jesus to prove, either way, that one could or could not lose his salvation. To read this into the parable is mere eisegesis.

CAB wrote:
It's sick to say that God gave Judas to Jesus as a devil, a son of perdition. It's sick to say that Jesus knew Judas was a devil and picked him for that reason so he would get him crucified. Only a Calvinist would think that way.

No, Judas never lost his salvation as you assert. He never had it. He was the "son of perdition" just like Jesus said. He was a "devil" just as Jesus said.

Now as far as Judas is concerned, the Scriptures declare this:

"Jesus answered them, Have not I chosen you twelve, and one of you is a devil? He spake of Judas Iscariot the son of Simon: for he it was that should betray Him, being one of the twelve." [John 6:70-71]

CAB wrote:
Hey, Judas was an apostle, who lived with Jesus, ate with Jesus, went everywhere with Jesus, was taught by Jesus 3 1/2 years. Judas was chosen by Jesus to be an apostle, the highest office in God's church, and it is outrageous, sick heresy to say Jesus picked Judas to be an apostle because he was a thief and a devil. Judas was not a thief or a devil when Jesus picked him, and Judas gave up all he had and owned to follow Jesus, 100 percent.

Further, Jesus sent Judas out to heal the sick, to preach the gospel, and cast out demons. And Judas did so.
Judas was the treasurer, Satan worked on his mind, like he works on all of us and the Bible tells us Satan is our enemy always tempting and telling filthy lies and trying to drive us crazy and manipulate us to do what Satan wants us to do. And Satan was able to convince Judas that Jesus was bad, and the Bible says Satan entered into Judas.
Jesus did not have to plot how to orchestrate his own crucifixion, to pick a devil to be his disciple and to name him an apostle and send him out to preach.

Mike wrote:
His premise was wrong, so his deep thoughts on its ramifications are wrong as well.

I posted the Russell quote merely to illustrate the preposterous conlusion that an atheist MUST come to if he were to think deeply about his atheistic premise.

Mike wrote:
I wonder if he believed in the existence of evil? If so, on what basis?

get real wrote:
Bunyan was a radical, he would have loved Saul Alinsky, Bunyan hung with the Ranters
Ranter http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ranter

Read the Wiki article again without prejudice, please. It clearly states that [quote]:

"John Bunyan, author of Pilgrim's Progress, claimed in his autobiography, Grace Abounding to the Chief of Sinners, to have encountered Ranters prior to his Baptist conversion."

That's ALL it says!

John Yurich USA wrote:
[snip] My priest made a trip to the Holy Land in 2010.

John, I thought that YOU were in the priesthood of believers. (1 Peter 2:5,9)

And I thought that you recognize only ONE high priest. (various passages throughout the book of Hebrews ... please read!)

Romans 14

And this:

TeenChristian wrote:
Yeah sure, blame societies problems on the youth.

One of the Fathers of Atheism, Bertrand Russell, was such a deep thinker and to his credit he proclaimed the following:

"... Man is the product of causes which had no prevision of the end they were achieving; his origin, his growth, his hopes and fears, his loves and his beliefs, are but the outcome of accidental collocations of atoms; no fire, no heroism, no intensity of thought and feeling, can preserve an individual life beyond the grave; all the labours of the ages, all the devotion, all the inspiration, all the noonday brightness of human genius, are destined to extinction in the vast death of the solar system, the whole temple of Man’s achievement must inevitably be buried beneath the débris of a universe in ruins—all these things, if not quite beyond dispute, are yet so nearly certain, that no philosophy which rejects them can hope to stand. Only within the scaffolding of these truths, only on the firm foundation of unyielding despair, can the soul’s habitation henceforth be safely built."

The modern age (with its technology and all its various social/political support systems) has indeed made the consequences of sin more ... livable(?)
Furthermore, guilt and shame are conditions which the modern age has attempted to irradicate from the human psyche. Just about any harmful condition is considered a "disease" treatable with drugs or forms of psychotherapy.

"Sin" is not recognized as sin(except when its against the environment or animals).

John for JESUS wrote:
I think much of the confusion comes from an incorrect interpretation of Romans 8:29. Calvinist have always been taught those predestined are unbelievers predestined to be saved. In actuality, it is speaking of those already saved being predestined to be conformed to the image of Christ at the Ressurection.

Neil wrote:
And who ever used the Bible to argue that the Earth is flat?

Christopher000 wrote:
I just wanted to say, as an outside observer, that I thought it was great how the latter half of this thread went, and JSC, I always like your responses. Some complain about what they read on a Christian site. Some say they can't believe the drama, the arguing, the infighting, etc. I view this thread as an example of how things would normally go when disrupters don't chime in with combative nonscense. We can argue and disagree but without the ever present negative elements, I don't think anyone would ever have any reason to be put off.

Such a success that today we have far fewer insured than on the day BEFORE "ObamaCare" was signed into law!

[As vice-president Joe Biden on May 23, 2010 whispered into Obama's ear: "This is a big f***ing deal!"]

Jim Lincoln wrote:
Well, from his comments we all know that wasn't God's representative on earth. :-7 Ah, 'tis a pity I don't have just a 5th grade education, then I would be qualified to be a commentator, [URL=http://withchrist.org/talkradio.htm]]]Left & Right Voices in Talk Radio & TV[/URL], but unfortunately, I not only graduated from high school but also from college, which makes me way over-qualified to be one for this lucrative job. I'm also too old to be a rock 'n roll singer. No other way, to become a mufti-millionaire then try to elected to Congress or become a televangelist. :-7