8And there were in the same country shepherds abiding in the field, keeping watch over their flock by night.

9And, lo, the angel of the Lord came upon them, and the glory of the Lord shone round about them: and they were sore afraid.

10And the angel said unto them, Fear not: for, behold, I bring you good tidings of great joy, which shall be to all people.

11For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

12And this shall be a sign unto you; Ye shall find the babe wrapped in swaddling clothes, lying in a manger.

13And suddenly there was with the angel a multitude of the heavenly host praising God, and saying,

14Glory to God in the highest, and on earth peace, good will toward men.

15And it came to pass, as the angels were gone away from them into heaven, the shepherds said one to another, Let us now go even unto Bethlehem, and see this thing which is come to pass, which the Lord hath made known unto us.

16And they came with haste, and found Mary, and Joseph, and the babe lying in a manger.

Norman Smith wrote:
I would like a bit of advice please,from anyone,no matter what persuasion.
The church i belong to plan to have an open air Carol Singing session on Dec.15th.They will also be preaching and handing out gospel tracts.
I kind of feel that i should not join with them, because of the history and roots of *Christmas*.

Jhawk44 wrote:
The world of 1984 is an impossibility, because it is a world without God, and only a world without God is capable of making what is portrayed in it.
Even so, tyranny is on the rise. But my outlook is positive. It is hard for rich men to enter the kingdom of God, but when your economy dissolves, you are no longer the big man on campus and are a destitute impoverished nation, you might, shall we say, be less attentive to humanists(who have brought about all this destruction by their turning away from God) and more to God.

3Blessed is he that readeth, and they that hear the words of this prophecy, and keep those things which are written therein: for the time is at hand.

Now thats a good book.

Wayne M. wrote:
That would be an interesting Supreme court case. The "right to bear arms" could be carried to extremes if it meant people with mental illness could carry guns or if it meant anyone could own and carry a howitzer or a machine gun when they go out. How far does one carry this right?
Hopefully the court will bring some sanity to this issue. People also have a right to live in safety without the fear of being shot by someone with a few loose screws as has often happened.

Didn't Canada outlaw guns, did crime go down? Did murder cases decrease?

This isn’t Romney’s first presidential race (his father George also ran in 1968);And has never won, nor his daddy

He is a successful businessman, having made a great impact at Bain Capital;and that is what? resume filler

He helped save the 2002 Winter Olympic Games in Salt Lake City; Superman -from what-evil supports the UN also I guess, come on Salt Lake-mormon

He raised a nice family; can't touch this one

He is Pro-Life; His plan is to let each state decide if they want to kill babies

He defends traditional marriage; Biblical, or state. see next item

He was a successful governor in the liberal state of Massachusetts; is this like a plus, dosn't that state have gay marriage

He has advantages over the other Republican candidates; I guess if being a mormon counts

He can defeat the “too perfect” critique; this one is to easy

His Mormonism is not a negative aspect to this presidential candidate ** no God will not hold this against the USA**

something like that?

Not to belittle this just a easy example,
you will get the car of your dreams-predestination
You pick the car-election
you drive the car- cool

Jhawk44 wrote:
Funny, I just finished reading 1984 then see this.

Give up FREEDOM for SECURITY
if you do that, how secure will you feel
ask anyone in jail if there glad to be safe.

JP wrote:
My challenge, I still have yet to here a resonable answer to the challenge that I posted.
Eternal Security is merely a philosophical extension of divine election, rather than a Scriptural mandate. It can be found indirectly in passages that could be implying something else or by philosophical presumptions but nowhere does it outright state unconditional eternal security anywhere in Scripture. If I am wrong, reprove me.

Eternal Security, not eternal life right, or is that included?

You mean after your saved, Holy Spirit, Jesus statments,ie I will be with you always. Maybe I missed some part of this disscussion, sounds like your looking for a conformation of Gods predestination.? is that it?
Just because you don't like Ron Paul is no reason for people not to help you out.

Mac Man wrote:
Terry & R.K.
I have no idea who "spiritual" was or is. This is the first time I've ever commented at this site. I think you guys might be getting a little too conspiratorial minded.
My point in asking the question of the primary importance of the crucifixion is to challenge the seeker-sensitive, social gospel view that man is the center of the universe and God at his every whim or beck and call...
Now... do you follow on that or are you going to revert to tag-team ad hominim ?
Mac Man

terry evans wrote:
Lets see , Pat is not a christian
thats not it, although he is born republican again
I know,
RON PAUL,
the christian vote
Anti guy,
say Hi to Susan.
Susan Miller wrote:
It does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in people's minds. - Samuel Adams
Hello Terry Evans and AntiVaticanistAmerican! TOUCHE

AntiVaticanistAmerican wrote:
Again:

thats not it, although he is born republican again

I know,

RON PAUL,
the christian vote

Anti guy,
say Hi to Susan.

Was Come wrote:
Come now, riches doesn't condemn nor make a man, its the mans devotion that condemns or makes him. Matt 19:24 doesn't say that riches are evil but it is the devotion that men have to their riches that is the concern and may ultimately condemn them. It would be better that we do not take on the temptation of riches, for if YOU are asked to give up the riches you may not want to, same as the 'young man in Matt 19:24' and maybe Creflo...
Do not condemn nor judge but if you feel a man is in error should you not pray AND appeal to them?

Error, this man is what a pastor, or is he the rev. He is way past error.

Anna wrote:
Very true RK Borill, except Matthew 25 v.31-46 are also spoken by Jesus. Confusing
really, but obvious also that faith without works is dead as James said.
Some try to explain these verses as Jesus not speaking to Christians, but that is stretching it I think. Whoever he is speaking to, those with works are the "righteous" and we cannot ignore it

Susan Miller wrote:
It does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in people's minds. - Samuel Adams
Hello Terry Evans and AntiVaticanistAmerican! TOUCHE!

White wrote:
Biblically and experientially untrue!!
Jesus taught
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.(Matt 7)

He was talking to "christians", or those who say they are, like 85% of the usa.