B. McCausland wrote: God given guidelines and utopias are two different things, they work against each other in a fallen world. The difference is that God's guidelines contribute to the benefit and improvement of societies, while utopias as communism end in oppression, disillusion, disaster and dispair
Sister, one of the problems is that you are using manmade terms to illustrate manmade principles and focussing on them. Let us forget socialism and communism and Marxism and Leninisn and fascism and any other ism not found in the Bible (Calvinism, Arminianism, and so on).
Rather let us look at the teaching of Jesus Christ (which is Christianity) and see there the principles upon which God works. And we find it is upside down to what the world loves.
Matthew 6:24 KJV (24) No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.
[Our blessed Lord shows here the utter impossibility of loving the world and loving God at the same time; or, in other words, that a man of the world cannot be a truly religious character. How dangerous is it to set our hearts upon riches, seeing it is so easy to make them our God!] Clarke
B. McCausland wrote: Would you rather have it like this?
No, but this is how I've got it, and in forty years or more a Christian and ready for the grave, I doubt I'll ever see your utopia.
What I find amazing is that you claim to know God's will for society, yet God doesn't bless his own will and it cannot be found anywhere in the world. Don't you think that strange, sister?
Now if biblical Christianity was to be taught, instead of the pat on the head, believe these things and you'll have a great and prosperous life, maybe the rich would have a change of heart, and try to see and understand their struggling brethren, and communicate. Instead of this, they hoard their earnings and use it for private hospital treatment, and then say, "Look at how God is looking after me."
Have you ever wondered why the Word/Faith people never hold meetings among the poor? It is because they have nothing to put in their big buckets which they normally carry around auditoriums and immediately deposit in their bank accounts. Most excellent capitalism! Free Enterprise! And nothing illegal about what they do. This is much better than getting hand-me-outs, eh? Indulgences is another method, no different.
Adriel wrote: ""Jayne Ozanne and former evangelical Steve Chalke also want the Government to take action against any prayer, private conversation and preaching which does not affirm homosexual or transgender lifestyles."" PROOF if it was necessary that the CofE is the voice of the antichrist - NOT the voice of Jesus Christ. Satan's followers have definitely infiltrated the CofE and turned their religion into the evil UNBiblical religion of satanic Liberalism. May the Lord remove this evil works of Satan from what is called 'church' in the CofE. GOD clearly States:- Lev 20:13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them." AND:- Romans 1:24 Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves: 25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen. 26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: 27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman,"
B. McCausland wrote: Do you reckon God's principles are worth taking on board in any society or country? There you have your answer. God did not intend man to function as a member of a communal which would take responsibility of his needs, but as an individual with personal accountability exercising personal initiative, discernment and judgement. Surely the law included charitable guidelines for tragic outcomes, but not for the state to take over . Modern demographics have distorted this picture shifting responsibilities to the state, to the point of having today 'Christian Socialists' in the milenial rank of the evangelicals
Sure thing, God's ways are good and they are the best. But if the minority Christian sector cannot or will not attain to them, then you cannot blame the poorest Christians from getting help from wherever they can, which, in the UK, is from the beloved guv.
ISIS is getting nowhere fast. And even if they should make inroads in enforcing Islam on others, the Lord Jesus Christ, in his second advent, will destroy the lot of them together, and hurl them into the lake of fire.
Jayne, the fact that you are a member of the CoE General Synod means nothing to God. You are a sinner in need of a Saviour. And the Saviour will save you from your sins, so that you will think differently about sin. In the words of a multitude of evangelists, you need an "about turn".
B. McCausland wrote: Yes, this is the point, when taxes are used to redistribute wealth, provide Healthcare and hand outs, administer education, regulate policy, exercise charity and impose life styles, etc... The only role of the state is to punish evil, as given in Rom 13, not to be the all in all benefactor.
Sister B, are you saying that all public sector workers are non kosha, unless they are working in the justice departments?
And are you saying that we ought go back to those dreadful days when the poor in society could not access any medical treatment or a dentist because of the cost?
And that if your house was on fire, all you could expect was a little help from neighbours with buckets of water, and no-one was there who could rescue granny from her top floor apartment, so she died.
And there would be no free loan of books from places like libraries?
And many children would never attend a school because their parents could not afford to pay for their education?
And a man who had been mugged and left half dead in the street could expect no help from the guv, even though he could never work again due to his injuries?
Dr. Tim wrote: A denomination that teaches salvation by works (baptism and âpersevering to the end) may be religious, but it isnât Christian.
This Church of Christ denomination must be quite rare in the UK bro, but if that is what they believe, then certainly they are not Christian. All Christians persevere to the end, but that is not the means of their salvation, but their fruitful evidence of the grace of God in their lives.
Frank wrote: Yes brother, I remember in communist Romania that the local authorities had to approve sermons; it was illegal to witness outside a church setting; and it was illegal to sell or print Christian books. What we are seeing is the beginning of the end brother.
This also is what I believe brother pilgrim. It is escalating rapidly.
I was thinking yesterday about how long it would take for a steam locomotive to get up enough steam for it to start work. I concluded a lot longer than it would take for a diesel locomotive to be ready for action.
The Almighty is getting up steam, not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance. _______________
Chrisgp from England wrote: ...into requiring vaccines to carry some kind of permanent identity marker or luminous dye, and to make the vaccine mandatory for all with no exceptions allowed, but even for any religious reasons.
Hi Chris, I do not know if this account is true, but this is what Michelle Roberts, the health online editor, said about:-
Will the vaccines be compulsory?
"No. It will be optional and offered first to those who could benefit the most, such as the elderly and healthcare workers."
"Englandâs Health Secretary Matt Hancock has confirmed: âWe are not proposing to make this compulsory â not least because I think the vast majority of people are going to want to have it.â"
"If it becomes available, children will not routinely be offered it because they are low risk."
Apparently it will shortly be available, and then we will know whether or not it is compulsory and part of a plot.
Frank wrote: Perfectly said Pilgrim! The below will become a reality one of these days. We are to not love anyone more than the Lord; our spouses, parents or siblings, etc. Matthew 10:21 And the brother shall deliver up the brother to death, and the father the child: and the children shall rise up against their parents, and cause them to be put to death.â
Amen brother! That is the very text I was thinking of. Britain may not be communist yet, but it certainly seems to be headed that way. And believers in communist countries often mention the need for great carefulness in speech and writing, in the books they have written.
Rather you think I am just "full of programming that influences my thoughts and decisions accordingly".
Well if God is sovereign in the way that you believe he is sovereign, then there is nothing to be done about it.
And then you think that "it is my fault if I stay in that spot and do not attempt to search out the truth".
And then you ask "Does man have the ability to make decisions outside of God's influence?"
You see the problem? You say one thing and then immediately turn it upside down by saying something contrary.
Besides which, great tomes have been written over many centuries on the subject of God's sovereignty, and yet you expect answers to several questions about it in one small post? If I took that information to a spiritual shrink, he would brand you as quite spiritually abnormal.
p.s. I do not think that anyone who posts regularly on this forum could give a definitive and exhaustive answer to the question, "What does it mean that God is sovereign?"
Watcher wrote: Please try to understand and don't read between the lines as most do. I will try to be clear. The governments of the world are corrupt. They don't care about you, only your money and subservience. They will elect whom they want to elect and there's nothing you can do to prevent that from happening. If you think you live under a democracy, then you are naive and living in a fairy tale land. There is no such thing as a democracy on earth. There never was. If you don't believe me, then try and force your MLA/Senator or elected official to work on your behalf at the risk of losing his job and you'll see what happens. I've been there and KNOW for a fact, that I mean nothing to the government. My elected representatives are nothing more than cardboard cutouts and have no power to do anything but ensure they have a long career and a good retirement fund. This is reality. Trump, Biden, or whoever are spokesmen for those they serve, and the powers that run the show on this earth will put in power he/she who will fulfill their plans accordingly.
I know all that, Watcher. You think I'm stupid or something?
But the answer is not in hyperCalvinism or Que Sera Sera. Neither are biblical.