Amazing how the centuries old argument over Eph 2:8 continues. Calvinists insist faith is â€śtheâ€ť gift and Arminians insist salvation is the gift.
Both sides have their theology in view and interpret accordingly. Problem with the latter is salvation is a verb, not a noun...... not a possession and the word "Salvation" is not even present in the verse for â€śthe gift of Godâ€ť to point to.
Problem with the former is no where in the NT is faith stated to be a gift but grace is.
Instead, I'm of the opinion that biblical faith is the fruit of the indwelling Holy Spirit (Gal 5:22) which is the life of Christ and part and parcel of the gift of grace. Furthermore, faith is not given; rather it buds and blossoms(Isa. 27:6) into life (the just shall live by faith) in the heart of those who hear (ears to hear) or read (with eyes to see and a heart to perceive) the word of God.
Rom 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
Alright, one more Just so you don't misconstrue my last point. Calvinism is not mentioned by name, neither is Arminian, only the promised new name Isaiah 62:2 aka Christian.)
what's all over the place?
I had said "The Deliverer" was mentioned all over the place in Scripture yet I should have just mentioned you seek out Isa. 59:20 as Paul cited it in Rom 11:26 which means Isa 59:20 And context should be consulted in order to understand what Paul is speaking about in Rom 11:26. If you do so, I think you will find your point that your hammering away at is null and void.
J4J, I see I did not finish my thought so let me amend my last post from earlier today.
I was saying its all over the place in Scripture yet your continued focus on this forced stuff and an unhealthy angst for something that isn't even mentioned in the bible aka Calvinism is what keeps you from testing all things through Scriptural means alone.
Anyway, I'm not wanting to continue on with this. So that's all for me.
Jude 1:3 Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for **the faith which was once delivered unto the saints**.
Delivered. By whom? The Deliverer. Search out the term in a KJV. Its all over the place in Scripture yet your continued focus on this forced stuff and an unhealthy angst for something that isn't even mentioned in the bible aka Calvinism. Good day to you.
Paul, in 1 Tim 1:12-14 says he was enabled (not spellbound) by Christ Jesus due to his unbelief which Paul clearly owns as his prior state.
1 Tim 1:14 is the only text I am aware of which clearly tells us what grace is; faith and love and that (faith and love) is in Christ Jesus. It's His to give to whom He calls.
As for sinners putting their faith in Christ: Faith is a fruit of the Holy Spirit; faith justifies(Rom. 5:1); faith is righteousness(Rom.5:9). A sinner has none of this to offer Christ. It all has to come from Him as an unmerited gift. The misunderstanding regarding faith likely comes from an age old misconception that biblical faith simply means man's innate ability, through logic, to believe something that makes sense. It's a definition that has no basis in scripture and, quite frankly, has given multitudes a false sense of security.
Finally, the grace of God through Jesus Christ, faith and love, has to come in conjunction with the indwelling Holy Spirit as faith is a fruit of the HS (Gal.5:22, Eph 5:9) and without it there would be no belief. And if we don't believe, we are none of His.
John for JESUS wrote: James Thomas... No, being forced to believe like Calvinism teaches, is not found in scripture. Now comes the denials. However, if a person who doesnâ€™t want to believe is made willing to believe against their previous desires, then that is forced and really a contrived faith. God doesnâ€™t need or want that kind of â€śfaithâ€ť.
When God opened David's ears of what God did not desire not require despite the Jews teaching it to be so, it was done in lovingkindness like all other mentions in Scripture from what I see and not this force thing you mention.
Psalm 40:6 Sacrifice and offering thou didst not desire; **mine ears hast thou opened**: burnt offering and sin offering hast thou not required.
John UK wrote: St James, are you serious? Show me how you go about interpreting the following verse of scripture. Revelation 13:18 KJV (18)Â Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six. So far, I have that six hundred threescore and six is the number of a man who is also a beast. I can't seem to get past that, bro.
John, While I'm happy to share, I can see this study would be quite involved and more questions would arise. Unfortunately time is not on my side right now to do so. When I do get the time I will shoot you an email.
John UK wrote: St James, different men can study only the scriptures and come up with different interpretations. What happens then?
Simple, allow the Scripture to interpret itself. Consult the prophets where the topic of discussion is spoken of with a contrite heart. Follow the citations. Seek biblical definitions. Iron can sharpen iron, just need to keep humbly seeking to be taught of Him as He promised He would((Isa 54:13, John 6:45).
Thank you for the kind reply regarding your perception St. John.
My entire point to that post was to show how your opinions on what I say are being articulated along with your correlations and then you present them as if they are all proven facts.
You have provided another example of this in your last post in your implying that I have elevated myself above past theologians. That is your perceived opinion and nothing more. The truth is, I don't elevate myself above them John; I just recognize them as men just like me who are fallible and because of that John is why I advocate using Scripture as the measuring stick and not ANY theologian.
I am of the opinion that just because a popular theologian has said it and many people believed it does not make it a fact and should not be the validation of any truth. What saith the LORD should hold that title.
When we read 2 Tim 3:16, In following Paul's example, we are not to depart from the pages within the covers of the bible to put things to the test. But some don't see it that way and instead would take for example J. Gills's commentary conclusions as the measuring stick even though it could be demonstrated that it stands in contradiction to Paul and the prophets commentary. Blessings to you John
Mike wrote: The Lord saw fit to let me find a 200 year old Bible in the attic of a house we bought, led me to read some of it, and led me to believe what it said. No coincidence.
Hey Mike, My wife and I enjoy being grandparents very much. The grands are such a joy be around and being a part of seeing so many firsts with them in life that we may have missed in our own children due to work or other reasons. Thank you for sharing that most wonderful testimony. I could not help but think that it gives the perfect picture of what "Faith coming by hearing the word of God" means. He knew then and knows now what He's doing with His Word and with us as His own as well. We are in good hands. Thanks and God's blessings to you and yours!
St. John, My intention was to note that Gill looked to other Scripture for answers which is what I understand we are instructed to do per Paul's example. Me not agreeing with Gill has nothing to do with a long departed brother, but everything to do with following where Scripture leads. But like I said, that's another conversation which I'm not inclined to enter into right now. Blessings to you and pray those aches and pains you have depart for good.