People whom God effectually calls to salvation, are also justified freely by HIS grace.

God does this NOT by making them righteous, But HE pardons their sin, thereby accepting them as righteous.
NOT for anything worked IN the sinner - NOR indeed done by them; BUT for Christ's sake alone.

This is NOT imputing faith to them, but by imputing the obedience of Christ Crucified unto them.

They then rest completely upon Christ's righteousness by the GIFT of Faith.

Ro 3:24 "Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus"

1Cor 1:30 "But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:
31 That, according as it is written, He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord."

2Cor 5.19 "To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation."
21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him"
______________________________________

The problem then is in the definition of "faith."

For the Christian "faith" is a gift of God.
Eph 2.8 "For by grace are ye saved through faith; and THAT *NOT* OF YOURSELVES: it is the gift of God:
9 *NOT* of works, lest any man should boast." = ((WHY does he here repeat the idea of human works? = "Grace" clearly is NOT human, - only the error of assuming faith to be of entirely human origin, justifies this addition))

1Cor 2.5 "That your faith should NOT stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God"

b.a. wrote:
talk about misappropriating scripture!
i stand behind my own denomination on this one.

Come now ba, do we not have the right to debate your post without the aggro?

Even if we are "both" of the Christian struggle here on earth.

You've changed the spelling Yamil - Before you were posting under "Infecting" now it sounds more accurate with your last two posts as an "Infection"

But your address is still spelt wrong it should be "Devastating" - NO "h" in it.

BTW
You said
"Now Walt where are the words that state that God has chosen an arbitrary few unto salvation and the rest to hell?"

Remember you are living amongst all the people who democratically elected everybody in Stormont.

Rp 13.1 "Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God.
2 Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation."

Paul wrote this at a time of military occupation. At least you and your neighbours got the democratic choice, from God.

JD wrote:
The calvs apply the following verse to themselves, out of context of course, and cannot be convinced otherwise in spite of those like me who exegete it for them correctly. (( ))
Joh 15:16 Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, ....

"True, the subject now in hand is not the ordinary election of believers, by which they are adopted to be the children of God, but that special election, by which he set apart his disciples to the office of preaching the Gospel.
BUT if it was by free gift, and not by their own merit, that they were chosen to the apostolic office, MUCH MORE is it certain that the ELECTION, by which, from being the children of wrath and an accursed seed, we become the children of God, IS OF FREE GRACE.

Besides, in this passage Christ magnifies his grace, by which they had been chosen to be Apostles, SO AS TO join with it that FORMER ELECTION by which they had been engrafted into the body of the Church; or rather, he includes in these words all the dignity and honor which he had conferred on them."
(John Calvin)

This copy of an e'mail separates creationism from intelligent design. and justly so.

But
Dawkins, the servant of Satan, says
"At no time was I given the slightest clue that these people were a creationist front,"

Thus "creationism" is attacked.

Spiritual wrote:
Now, no one here on these forums, besides Abigal, believes in any of the promises of Christ.

No one but you two can read Scripture???

Abigail wrote:
I pray you will come to the understanding of the truth and repent of your sins and be filled with the Holy Ghost.

Salvation by works does not work Abigail. Thats the Papal antichrists method and has long since been rejected by the True Church.

"Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (BY GRACE ye are saved)"

"For BY GRACE are ye saved through faith; and that NOT of yourselves: it is the gift of God:"

Spiritual wrote:
The natural man must confess his sins, depart from all inquity, renounce his own ambitions, desires, ........

Not another Arminian wrapped up in the Popish dogma of salvation by works????

Who needs a crucified Christ, Holy Spirit or Grace when you can do the lot yourself????

Can't you read plain english?

1Cor2.14"But the natural man receiveth **NOT** (R) **NOT** the things of the Spirit of God:"

Also
v10 "But God hath revealed them unto us BY HIS Spirit
v11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him - (Hence TWO types)
v12 Now we have received, *NOT* the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God = (*TWO*)
v13 ....*NOT* in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, BUT which the Holy Ghost teacheth"

It is blatantly obvious that Paul in these verses is comparing the [1] unbeliever state, - with [2] the believer state, and pointing out that they are very different.

ONLY Made different by God the Holy Spirit.

Or are Arminians/Free Willers in charge of that too?

= The "natural" state is that Pre-Christian state of the unbeliever whereby the mortal finds himself in, prior to any grace or work of the Holy Spirit.
Thus the natural person cannot receive the things of the Spirit. They seem rediculous to him and in his current state he cannot know about them.
Further qualification of this is evidenced by Paul's final sentence viz, that these things are "spiritually discerned"

So the conclusion here must be that in his natural estate the person cannot repent nor come to Christ in any way, without the prior gift of grace and spiritual discernment.

Therefore the Reformed teaching of Effectual call, regeneration THEN Faith/Repentance complies with Paul's teaching.

Thus verse 12, in 1Cor 2 on the "Christian state" explains that the knowledge, which grace and the Spirit impart are essential to know the things of God and the grace/Spirit "enables" the person to proceed from there.

"The world has grown old in sin. It has now more than ever hegun to trifle with it, either as a necessity which cannot he cured, or a partial aberration from good order which will rectify itself ere long. It is this tampering with evil, this refusal to see sin as God sees it, as the law declares it, and as the story of our race has revealed it, that has in all ages been the root of error and of wide departure from the faith once delivered to the saints. Admit the evil of sin with all its eternal consequences, and you are shut up to a divine way of dealing with it. Deny the evil of sin and the future results of that evil, and you may deny the whole revelation of God, set aside the cross, and abrogate the law."(H Bonar)