So did God love the whole world when He suffered all nations to walk in darkness before Jesus came into the world being without God and without hope in the world? Is the OT God the God of today? Of course and He is angry with the wicked everyday!
Does God love countless millions who God wonâ€™t call with His Spirit and command the light to shine out of darkness? Of course not how can Jesus proclaim to many I never knew you if God has loved them, can two walk together unless they be in agreement let alone the Trinity be divided?
If the world HAS to mean all as you proclaim then we should marvel not that every single person hates us because of Christ! Oh but we know we will be loved of the brethren so scripture interprets who the â€śworldâ€ť is in that verse as it makes no sense according to scripture to say that â€śworldâ€ť in that verse means every single person! Now we know from my earlier comment that God hates some so how in the world do you interpret â€śworldâ€ť in John 3:16 as every person?
You donâ€™t want to see John is the problem. It is amazing what some will do to justify their actions instead of submit to the word of God! You keep playing that one string â€śworldâ€ť violin I will seek the whole council of the Lord.
John whatâ€™s with all the traditions of man? With the traditions of men you make the word of God of no effect!
15All their wickedness is in Gilgal: FOR THERE I HATED THEM: for the WICKEDNESS of their doings I will drive them out of mine house, I WILL LOVE THEM NO MORE: all their princes are revolters.
Do you believe that God hated them in the above verse for their wickedness as the Bible proclaims John? The answer should be a yes if you believe the Bible. Now do you suppose God just â€śpickedâ€ť on these people or is it how He deals with all?
5The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: THOU HATEST ALL WORKERS of iniquity.
God gave you the answer right there. Why in the world would God say this if He loves all already?
21â€śHe that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me SHALL BE LOVED of my Father, and I WILL LOVE HIM, and will manifest myself to him.â€ť
Makes absolutely no sense to say â€śI WILL Love himâ€ť if Jesus loves them already.
You go and dig up more of the writings of men John to make the clear word of the Bible of none effect. P.s John Calvin believed in baptizing babies so obviously he was a fallible man so why hide behind him? We have PROVEN Scripture dictates who the â€śworldâ€ť is.
John UK wrote: 1 John 5:1 KJV (1)Â Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God... Those who believe that Jesus is the Christ have been born again.
Just as simple as that right? Then you need to accept Catholics and JW. The Bible says there will be many false Christâ€™s.
Letâ€™s take AM if he believes in a â€śJesusâ€ť who loves everyone then he simply believes in a false Christ as Jesus will cast many to hell proclaiming â€śI NEVER knew youâ€ť
If someone believes God loves everyone he believes in a false God as God proclaims Jacob have I loved and Esau have I HATEDâ€ť
How in the world can God love some and Jesus proclaim to many He never even knew them? Is the Trinity divided
2 Corinthians 11:4
4 For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another spirit, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him.
This â€śJesusâ€ť who wants to save everyone is not the Jesus who prayed not for the world but for His sheep.
This â€śJesusâ€ť who died for everyone is not the Jesus who laid down His life for the sheep.
This â€śJesusâ€ť who wants to save man but canâ€™t is no Jesus at all! For He shall save His people! Why the broad road?
Another Michael wrote: Ladybug you keep saying things like its 'because they are predestined to', 'because they are not of the elect' while Jesus Christ says its because their hearts have grown dull.
Iâ€™m sorry Michael my post belongs to this comment. I like how you complained about where I put the comment to sidetrack from what was in the comment.
AM your comment made no sense at all. Who hardens the heart and stops the ears and gives a spirit of slumber to men? God does according to his word. I know that enraged you. Romans 11:8 8 (According as it is written, God hath given them the spirit of slumber, eyes that they should not see, and ears that they should not hear unto this day. God has to give a heart to believe! Deut 29 Deuteronomy 29:4 Yet the LORD hath not given you an heart to perceive, and eyes to see, and ears to hear, unto this day. Luke 8:10 And he said, Unto you it is given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God: but to others in parables; that seeing they might not see, and hearing they might not understand.
Jesus spoke to some in parables so they might not see. This is the Jesus of the Bible. When someone didnâ€™t hear Jesusâ€™s words He simply said they hear not because they are not of my sheep.
John Yurich USA wrote: Well Kev being a Calvinist is incapable of making sense since Calvinism does not make any sense whatsoever with its salvation doctrine that states that God predestinates those who will be saved and those who will be spending eternity in Hell. That kind of salvation system goes against the teaching of Jesus to go into all the world and preach the Gospel so that individuals can receive salvation.
How does God in His sovereignty choose to save sinners? By the preaching of the gospel. You have no idea what you are saying. When you leave The RCC then I will even consider what you are saying. Until then continue actually drinking the actual blood of Christ at mass with a bunch of idolaters who pray to saints and â€śMaryâ€ť.
You should answer Ladybugs question before you speak against such thing you donâ€™t understand.
Lurker wrote: Exactly, Kev. 1 Peter 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ: Gotta go.
Jesus did say they do make the outside clean and I donâ€™t think He meant a bath
39 And the Lord said unto him, Now do ye Pharisees make clean the outside of the cup and the platter; but your inward part is full of ravening and wickedness.
I see what you are saying. Have a good day Bro. â€” John check Heb 8 I believe that will help with what you were talking with Lurker about.
Since before the foundation of the world. I donâ€™t really see what your getting at John.
John UK wrote: Here is the testimony of a man who does not yet believe on the Son of God, but he knows Jesus healed him...
First you said it was a 10 second conversion now your saying he does not yet believe on the Son of God. You are all over the place John. â€” Hey Lurker I see what you are talking about with Johnâ€™s baptism compared to Jesusâ€™s baptism. One the purifying of the flesh the other of the conscience. â€” Observer a lot of good verses about the importance of doctrine. â€” AM your comment made no sense at all. Who hardens the heart and stops the ears and gives a spirit of slumber to men? God does according to his word. I know that enraged you.
8 (According as it is written, God hath given them the spirit of slumber, eyes that they should not see, and ears that they should not hear unto this day.
God has to give a heart to believe!
Deut 29 Deuteronomy 29:4 Yet the LORD hath not given you an heart to perceive, and eyes to see, and ears to hear, unto this day.
Luke 8:10 And he said, Unto you it is given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God: but to others in parables; that seeing they might not see, and hearing they might not understand.
Your trying to say that since the atonement was made for all Israel then That shows the atonement Christ made was for all but effectual only for those who accept Christ?
You arenâ€™t seeing that it still is a picture of particular atonement for Israel a picture of the Church and not for the Gentiles. Your argument is faulty. The picture of the OT atonement is still a picture of limited atonement unless you say it was for the Gentiles as well.
Your arguments are not even making since. Where in the the Bible does it state the atonement was sufficient for all?
UPS the flavor of Johnâ€™s post lately has been very hard to understand. Either he isnâ€™t getting his point across right which I hope is the case or he seems to be changing his point of view though he doesnâ€™t come out and say it. Or he has some agenda in what he posts. Either way he needs prayers as so do all of us. I would like to have back the old John I use to talk to on here.
I believe being actually born of the Spirit is instantaneous but I donâ€™t believe that is what John was hinting at at all. Look at his later 12 second comment. His whole thing lately is â€śyou donâ€™t need Doctrineâ€ť and viewing his comment in light of this point he has been pushing lately made me respond as I did.
UPS you asked why John brought it up. Donâ€™t you know he is the one who usually always starts this stuff? He brings up something like a â€śten second â€ś conversion which definetly isnâ€™t biblical then waits for others to point out his error by the Bible then goes look at those arguementative people! What nonsense.
The thief on the cross was probably a Jew He also had the testimony that Christ had a kingdom so he knew something a little more than just 12 seconds from beginning to end.
Hey there Observer I am having a hard time with Johnâ€™s points too lately. Itâ€™s good that some are willing to point him in the right direction when he seems to be straying. I hope we all stop and give John some prayer.
JW believe in Jesus too! Iâ€™m guessing all they have to believe is that Jesus healed people. your comments are straying from the faith.
Not every detail is written in the Bible so for you to say the jailer was healed instantly is not correct either. Iâ€™m guessing you donâ€™t believe that Paul witnessed to the jailer before this or heard Paul witnessing to others before the jail cells were flung open supernaturally.
John UK wrote: Hi Kev The man in question knew virtually no theology compared to you. Note, John 9:24-25 KJV (24)Â Then again called they the man that was blind, and said unto him, Give God the praise: we know that this man is a sinner. (25)Â He answered and said, Whether he be a sinner or no, I know not: one thing I know, that, whereas I was blind, now I see. That was all he knew. Jesus had restored his sight. That's it. And for giving his testimony of healing he was thrust out of the synagogue. Of course, you want to apply all your theology to his conversion, but the scriptures do not do that. It tells it like it is. You can check it out with all the other conversions in the gospels. On the human level (our world) all the conversions were very simple. Of course they were also profound, because of the effectual call of Jesus Christ, but simple nonetheless.
So all he had to do to be saved is believe Jesus gave him sight no proclamation Jesus Christ is the Son of the living God.
John your comments are either not getting across what you want them to or you are having some problems. Reread your comment.
He was a Jew John and should of been looking for the Messiah when Jesus gave him eyes to see. I donâ€™t want to lead off into a thousand posts so you can be right. I just wanted to address your â€śten secondâ€ť and â€śsimpleâ€ť remark.
I see nothing simple with conversion it is literally raising the dead by the power of God and the power of God is the word of God. No way can a person who has never heard of God be converted in 10 seconds and is not fair to compare the apostolic period with its might gifts of the Holy Spirit with today, neither the conversions of Christ Himself, or the conversion of Jews who had the word of God. I donâ€™t see how you can argue with anything I just said.
John you cannot say it took less than 10 seconds. He was a Jew who probably his whole life had heard Jesus talked about over and over as the scripture are they which testify of Him. He was also healed from being blind before that. That is not an accurate to say it takes 10 seconds to convert someone and it is as easy as that. You also need to consider it was Jesus Christ Himself who converted Him. In fact His conversion was so difficult that without God electing Him unto life and causing Him to be blind and all the events that led to His conversion and the Holy Spirit giving him eyes to see and ears to hear and raising the man from the dead he would of just been a seeing dead man.
Not accurate to compare Jesusâ€™s conversions (especially Jews) to normal conversions. We know that the Word of God is the power of God unto salvation. We know you cannot convert someone off the street who doesnâ€™t know the Bible in 10 seconds.
MS wrote: Hi there Kev, it was a good little sermon to point Chris to, it touched on many of the points that he has questions concerning. Good afternoon sister ladybug
Yeah I think it is absolutely perfect for him Iâ€™m off to get ready for church you all have a good day! â€” Sounds good there Watcher. Yeah I donâ€™t really know all the nonsense with some preachers as I donâ€™t really listen to any of them. I know when I hear that Gospel being preached it is music to my ears and I donâ€™t hear that music from all preachers thatâ€™s for sure. Many will think Iâ€™m unloving but I want people to know the God of the Bible and accept Him as it is life eternal to know the one true God and Jesus Christ who He has sent! â€” Thanks Sister for the recommendation!
Watcher wrote: I have had my fill of this. John Piper embraces Rick Warren. John MacArthur embraces John Piper. Both men embrace RC Sproul. Where's the rebuke? Where's the separation? No more does iron sharpen iron. No, the iron of scripture has been replaced by velvet, in hope no one gets offended.
Yeah Iâ€™m not really into any of this preachers myself either. You can see this great compromise being ushered in by the Trojan horse of â€śloveâ€ť but biblical love isnâ€™t this â€śloveâ€ť we are seeing today. Real love doesnâ€™t come at the expense of truth. I enjoy many uncompromising preachers if youâ€™d like to know of some good ones I will include my email next to the magnifying box. Iâ€™m always looking for good faithful preachers as well.
Watcher wrote: Honestly, I for one am sick to death of this sort of thing. I am of Paul, you are of Apollos, he is of Sproul, she is of MacArthur...enough's enough! I am a Christian. I am a slave of Jesus Christ. Saved by Him, for Him and from Him. Period. If a man goes against scripture, especially in regards to this major point of doctrine, he is apostate and should have been rebuked years ago, not embraced as a brother.
I like your comment. I hate it when people assign the Doctrine of the Bible to mere men and not of God. I donâ€™t mind some who are in minor errors but to embrace them even in minor errors is not right either. Where I personally draw the line is when it involves the gospel of the sovereign grace of God in Christ Jesus. I think that Presbyterians are wrong but I believe I have Presbyterian brothers as many know the gospel. That doesnâ€™t mean I would go to a Presbyterian church though. We need less compromise in Christianity like you are saying. We see where that has gotten us! â€” Hey there MS I enjoyed that sermon you suggested. I pointed Christoper to it. I think it would be perfect for Bro. Christopher