"Increasingly, the only "doctrine" that really matters is the Charismatic doctrine of the Holy Spirit, as analysed above. As long as there is agreement on that, any heretic, regardless of how damnable his heresy, is welcomed as a brother in Christ. There have always been exceptions, but increasingly this has become the rule. For when the spirits are not tried by the Word of God (this having been set aside as an all-sufficient standard), but by those who claim to possess a miraculous gift of "discerning of spirits," then increasingly the ones who are "discerned" as being led by false spirits, or as denying the Holy Spirit, or even as committing the blasphemy against the Holy Spirit, are those who reject Charismatic subjectivism, believe the Bible to be the only infallible rule of faith and practice, and allow Scripture to interpret itself. Those who are orthodox in doctrine are, increasingly, being viewed as the heretics by those within the Charismatic Movement."

Quoting from Gospel Minister Shaun Willcock's timely article entitled:
'Charismatic Doctrine In The Light Of God’s Word'

"When the only divinely-given rule of faith is removed, then any excess of doctrine and conduct is possible! Remove the only standard whereby teachings can be judged, and it is possible to believe anything; any "fables" (2 Tim.4:3,4); any "wind of doctrine" (Eph.4:14); any "damnable heresies" (2 Pet.2:1); any "commandments of men" (Matt.15:9). And this is precisely what has happened in the Pentecostal/Charismatic Movement. It is the proud boast of many within the movement that they are not concerned with doctrine: "Doctrine divides; we don't want to know about doctrine! Love is what matters: love, and unity, and the power of the Holy Spirit!" This attitude has led Charismatics to embrace one heresy after another (and this attitude is itself a heresy). As long as a man speaks with tongues, or supposedly has some other "gift," that man is received as a "brother in Christ"–even if he denies the Trinity, or the true doctrine of Christ's atoning death, or the true doctrine of the new birth, or anything else!"

". . . the most dangerous part of the Pentecostal/Charismatic Movement is this: it is a denial of 2 Tim.3:15-17. It is a denial of one of the fundamental doctrines of the faith: that Scripture is all-sufficient; that it contains all that the Lord has been pleased to reveal; that no further revelation is to be given. However much many within the movement seek to deny this, it is nevertheless true. For in the early Church, tongues, and prophecy, and words of wisdom and knowledge, were revelations of the Holy Spirit! They came with a "Thus saith the Lord!" And if they are still given to men today, then new revelations are still being given. The Bible is not sufficient!"

As I said in a prior post
John,

the link between Charismatics and RCs is undeniable,
and as such is a most significant issue indeed.
See my prior post of (1/22/19 5:34 PM)

sc,
A Christian has the Holy Spirit and the Word.
Sign gifts are not needed and not all were to speak in tongues at the time when they were used.
*****
Amen . . amen!

sc:
You and I missed it, but there is a reference in God's Word to praying in tongues as pointed out
by: “here you go” in his post of 1/22/19 5:57 PM

The verse he cited is:
1 Corinthians 14:14 King James Version (KJV)
14 For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.

Notwithstanding, it matters not whether the reference to tongues is “speak” and/or “pray”, the gift
of tongues has ceased and been done away with at the completion of the Word of God . . the Bible,

as you have rightly pointed out in your post of 1/22/19 9:45 AM when you wrote:
“As for the true gift of tongues...a sign gift given for confirmation of what was communicated...with witnesses

If this fellow wants prophecy, he would do well to look at the completed revelation in Scripture.
There is no new revelation."
****
sc . .

as you said in an earlier post . . Romans 8:26

applies to all true believers . . those “born again” born of the Spirit; John 3:3-8; born of God (John 1:13)

I share with you an excerpt:
“Pentecostalism, when I was first introduced to it, appeared to me (as it has to so many other youngsters) to be biblical. It seemed to follow the Bible, to be alive, to preach (as it boasted) “the full Gospel”. How wrong I was! It appeared to fill the void which I felt within Methodism. I was a regenerated young man trying to fit into a false religious institution. It could not be done. I was a fish out of water. But sadly, going from Methodism to Pentecostalism, I went from one ecclesiastical error to another.”

He goes on to say:
"It was only in 1986 that I was fully delivered from all of that."

May God grant you discernment.

On a personal note, the Lord delivered my husband and I from RC

As for the true gift of tongues...a sign gift given for confirmation of what was communicated...with witnesses

If this fellow wants prophecy, he would do well to look at the completed revelation in Scripture.
There is no new revelation.''
*****

with this statement I wholeheartedly give my assent.

Gospel Minister Shaun Willcock of Bible Based Ministries enlarges upon this in his timely article entitled:

1) Charismatic Doctrine In The Light Of God’s Word

By way of a postscript . . sc,
I do value your contributions to this discussion and welcome your thoughts in the context of my prior post.

In Christ,

June

Neil wrote:
When a response concerns only editorial error, that tells me my input is not valued.

I did not say that. I only meant to ascribe proper credit.

“Someone correct me if I am wrong..I know that the Bible speaks of "SPEAKING" in tongues but does it say anything about "PRAYING" in tongues?..or have people mistakenly come up with the idea of praying in tongues ? One word makes a big difference sometimes in what is conveyed.”
*****

sc:
Well it does look like we were "corrected", as the passage of Scripture cited by “here you go” clearly reveals.

1 Corinthians 14:14 King James Version (KJV)
14 For if I pray in an unknown tongue, my spirit prayeth, but my understanding is unfruitful.

here you go,

Thanks for the correction

Sc . . I value your input and would appreciate your thoughts.

"For the very root of the Charismatic error, despite all their protestations to the contrary, is the denial of the sufficiency of the Word of God. And that has been Popery’s position for centuries.

This denial of the Bible’s sufficiency is why they are open to all kinds of supposed “new revelations” via tongues and prophecy. This is why they do not care whether these “new revelations” are even in accordance with Scripture or not. This is why experiences are more important than what the Scripture says. This is why one outrageous false doctrine after another has been eagerly embraced as the years have rolled by. And this is why the Charismatic Movement is sweeping multitudes into the Ecumenical Movement — or what can better be called the Romeward Movement.

For Romanism has always denied the sufficiency of Scripture! It has always insisted that there are “other revelations”: extra-biblical revelations. It has always said, “The Bible is not enough!” And now Charismatics are saying, “Forget what the Bible says! Doctrine is not important — experience is all that counts!” To which a pious “Amen” echoes around the corridors of the Vatican."

sc wrote:
You're very kind, June. I pray for discernment and am excited when the Lord can use even me.
It is notable how one word changes everything. I wonder if other "versions" of the Bible use "praying in tongues" instead of "speaking".

btw . .
It is always prudent to pray for discernment. (2 Peter 2:1)

In the context of this news items Shaun Willcock writes:
"Alas! What the Charismatics thought was “a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind” (Acts 2:2), was in reality the shrieking wind of false doctrine (Eph.4:14), which tossed them to and fro, finally dumping them at the entrance to the Vatican.
Charismaticism must be opposed for the heresy that it is! Though they will not endure sound doctrine, having itching ears (2 Tim.4:3), yet still sound doctrine must be proclaimed (vs.2)! For by this means, those whom the Lord has ordained to be recovered, will be! Against this ever-rising tide of chaos, we must contend!"

sc . .
I sense that we are of "like precious faith".

May the Lord continue to use your posts to direct sinners into the right way to His praise and glory alone.

In Christ,

From the Article:

5. CHARISMATICISM: the denial of the sufficiency of the Word of God, leading to Romanism. What began, around the turn of the century, as a movement on the very fringes of Protestantism, rightly rejected as unscriptural by those sound in the faith, moved during the second half of the century into the older Protestant denominations. Of course, by this time what was termed “Protestantism” was, for the most part, a mere shadow of its former self, unscriptural at its very root, riddled with heresy, brim-full of unregenerate souls. Into this doctrinal smorgasbord the Charismatic heresy slithered, and like a rather bland meal that can be made more palatable by the addition of certain spices, cold and lifeless “Protestantism” suddenly seemed to come alive! It seemed as if a new spirit had been breathed into it! There was joy, and shouting, and clapping, and dancing, and strange new sounds as well.

sc wrote:
I wonder which known foreign language he prays.
Romans 8:26
“Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered.”
CANNOT BE UTTERED
Someone correct me if I am wrong..I know that the Bible speaks of "SPEAKING" in tongues but does it say anything about "PRAYING" in tongues?..or have people mistakenly come up with the idea of praying in tongues ? One word makes a big difference sometimes in what is conveyed.
As for the true gift of tongues...a sign gift given for confirmation of what was communicated...with witnesses
If this fellow wants prophecy, he would do well to look at the completed revelation in Scripture.
There is no new revelation.

and what's more . . you have spoken out of the good treasure of your heart.

Luke 6:45a
A good man out of the good treasure of his heart bringeth forth that which is good;

sc wrote:
It seems that there is no privacy any more and since "91 one" we have been conveniently under high surveillance for "our own protection"...but even the anonymous "getting older" on a now closed thread got it wrong when saying that "3 women who do not attend church" ...kept the thread going
It's best to not say things when one doesn't know them to be true.Ironically, the one who was protesting the thread helped to shut it down by saying something that wasn't true which was the main objection to the topic at hand...it being against truth

"The truth,the whole truth and NOTHING but... "

God's Word . .
“You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. You shall not bow down to them or serve them, for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and the fourth generation of those who hate me, but showing steadfast love to thousands of those who love me and keep my commandments (Exodus 20:4-6).

So then . .

Churches that display these so-called "Nativity scenes" have effectively said . .

"Yea, hath God said?" Gen. 3:1

Be sure to read my related post of 1/7/19 8:06 PM

Article: How Protestant Nativity Scenes Proclaim Catholic Doctrine
Excerpt:
“Protestants would do well to ponder what their nativity scenes mean, and how they are scarcely different from Catholic veneration.

sc wrote:
"christmas" is not in the Bible nor does a one time event constitute a regular holy day.
Ironically, those who think that they may just make up holy days (again,not civil observances,which "christmas" is not any way)are those who come across as arrogant and puffed up by setting themselves as God,deciding for themselves that which God has not revealed.

Many seem to vainly imagine that Christian liberty means freedom to do as they please.

1) "there is a general supposition granted on all hands __ namely, that there must be a view of Christ and His glory, to cause us to love Him, and thereby to make us conformable or like unto Him. But here lies the difference: - Those of the Church of Rome say that this must be done by the beholding of crucifixes, with other images and pictures of Him;and that with our bodily eyes:
we say it is by our beholding His glory by faith, as revealed in the Gospel, and no otherwise."

Citation: 1) Works, by John Owen, Vol. 1, p. 393, as quoted in Pictorial Representations of Jesus Christ (tract), by D. K. Madden.

As Christ said . .
“But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit, and in truth.”
- John 4:23-24

John UK wrote:
Oh and I forgot to mention the long, feature window in the sanctuary, a beautiful piece of stained glass, showing a picture of Jesus the Good Shepherd with his little flock of sheep.
It could have come straight out of a RCC.

John Gill (18th c.)
“No image of God was to be made at all, since no similitude was ever seen of Him, or any likeness could be conceived; and it must be a piece of gross ignorance, madness and impudence to pretend to make one; and great impiety to worship it.”

Thomas Watson (17th c.)
“Nor the likeness of any thing” means, “All ideas, portraits, shapes, images of God, whether by effigies or pictures, is hereby forbidden to be made.” God is to be adored in the heart, not painted to the eye. To set up an image to represent God is to debase him. Idolatry is devil worship.”

B. McCausland wrote:
2. June, can you document that alliance?
Thanks
Greetings

Sinn Fein/IRA Triumphant
in Northern Ireland

John UK wrote:
The ones I have spoken to about it, are for sure either indifferent or oblivious to it all. They see themselves as the ones in the right, with no intention of seeking counsel from God's word.
I was in a Free Presbyterian church once, at this time of year, and I asked, "What is this big Christmas Tree doing in the main body of the building, where we have our worship?" And what did I get by way of a response? Laughter. Chuckling at me as though I was some spiritual party-pooper come out of an asylum.
I don't hang around a church like that.

John UK wrote:
Ah yes, June. I thought you meant Bible verses in support of such practices.
So Amen to that, God's commandments give us clear direction, as Geoff Thomas (SA broadcaster, now retired from his church) told me when I asked him face to face.

“You shall not make for yourself a carved image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth. You shall not bow down to them or serve them, for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers on the children to the third and the fourth generation of those who hate me, but showing steadfast love to thousands of those who love me and keep my commandments (Exodus 20:4-6).

John . . Is not the statue of the "baby Jesus", who never ceased to be God a violation of
Ex. 20:4-6?

John Gill (18th c.)