DefenderofTruth wrote:
So, why did JD post 3 consecutive posts this morning. How did that happen?

Usually when I take the time to present a scriptural case that cannot be refuted everyone just ignores it and later they will post the same ole tired errors as if they had never read my convincing argument. Just wait, someone will post sooner or later that one must be regenerated so they can believe. The calvinists commentators never learn.

BTW, I have told you that all the calvinists on here are hypers and if you are not, this place is not safe for you. The only calvinists that are treated good are the ones who toe the mark and subscribe to the collective mindset. If, for instance, you will not defend total depravity or original sin or the sovereignty of God as being true as laid out in the cathechisms, the confessions, the counsel of dorht, you will be ostricized. I've seen it before. These works are the real authority of these calvinists here whether they will admit it or not.

Now we have an anecdotal passage that illustrates the great doctrine of the indwelling Holy Spirit and when and on what basis he indwells the believer in Jesus Christ, his death, burial, and resurrection, the gospel.

Ac 10:43 To him (Jesus Christ) give all the prophets witness, that THROUGH HIS NAME whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.

Ac 10:44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.

45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.

47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we

In Acts 10 it is said they received the Holy Ghost but in chap 11 it is said

Ac 11:1 And the apostles and brethren that were in Judaea heard that the Gentiles had also received THE WORD OF GOD.

Cornelius was told words would save him!

Send men to Joppa, and call for Simon, whose surname is Peter;
14 Who shall tell thee words, whereby thou and all thy house shall be saved.

The Scripture says that we have life when we believe in Christ. But what is life?

Again, we have the trinitarian image presented to us.

God is life - 4:18
Jesus Christ is Life - 1 Jn 5:11
The Spirit is Life - Ro 8:10

So then, God has given us his son and says he that hath the son hath life because the life is in his son. But the son is a fleshly man and how does the son abide in our hearts?

1Jo 4:13 Hereby know we that we dwell in him, and he in us, BECAUSE HE HATH GIVEN US HIS SPIRIT.

How does God dwell in our hearts then?

1Th 4:8 He therefore that despiseth, despiseth not man, but God, WHO HATH ALSO GIVEN UNTO US HIS HOLY SPIRIT.

God is a trinity and if the Holy Spirit dwells in our heart then God the Father dwells there and the Son of God dwells there because God is ONE but it is the distict ministry of the third person of the trinity to dwell there. This is what the bible teaches and I do not have to fully understand it to believe it.

Alan H wrote:
When you say "the Holy Spirit is 'the life of God'" what do you mean? Do you not believe that the Holy Spirit is a distinct person within the Godhead, i.e. the Third Person of the Trinity? I don't want to assume something you never intended simply because I didn't understand what you meant.

Q 1 - I mean what God means. I am quoting him Ro 8:10. There is much said about the Holy Ghost in the scriptures. He is the person of the Godhead that is said to indwell us as the gift of God see Ro 6:23 when we believe, thus giving us the divine nature, 2 Pe 1:4.

But God is God, a trinity, and though able to be separate functionaly, yet still one (a mystery) because Christ dwells in our hearts Ep 3:17 and God the Father dwells in our hearts 2 Co 6:16 but it is the Holy Ghost, the Sprrit, who dwells there and resides and gives us the life of God. He makes us a new creation 2 Co 5:17 and reconciles us to him v 18. Our individual bodies are his temple 1 Co 6:19, and the church corporately is his eternal temple, Ep 2:21.

Mike just got lumped in with us because most of the guys are new here and any disagrement with tulip is akin to the unpardonable sin.

DOT may be a little different and if he is, this is not a safe place for him. The rest of these guys are hypers, as you already know.

I must say I have never seen this many new guys at the same time. enoughaready, lone wolf, front row, irresistible, german ated, unspeakablejoy, post reader, nickoftime and on and on.

Real bible believers seem to be the only people on here with real names like JD and Michael, and Mike, and Yamil, with real places where they are serving the Lord like Endicot, and Danville, and New York, and Vegas.

Have you ever wondered why almost all these calvinists are ashamed of their real names? I have. Has there ever been a bible believers here that was ashamed to say who he is? Maybe! But I can't think of one off the top of my head.

Is there a message here?

There was one calvinist that used his real name in the early days. His name was Walt from Michigan but the practice did not catch on with them.

Must have something to hide!

He is also a very good poet!

The Lone Wolf wrote:
JD, do you mind responding to my post.

Regeneration is the infusion of a new life in the heart and spirit of one who is dead in tresspasses and sin. It results in salvation, not a result of salvation or the same as salvation.

My goal here is to convince you and reason from the Scriptures that Jesus Christ is God, that he came in the flesh, lived a perfect life, and died in our place and whosoever will believe in him, without exception, will receive eternal life. This life is his Spirit that indwells us forever.

By this message I hope to win some of you to Christ. By that I do not mean that I think all of you are lost. Some of you are saved I think, in spite of this confused contorted doctrine, but some, if not most, of you are not if your words mean anything.

I gave a series of verses from epistles that were given by God for the purpose of explaining the Christian faith and you and others respond by simply ignoring them and presenting your theology, trying to make the square peg fit into the round hole.

First JU,

It is a remarkable thing that you have ignored all the doctrinal statements concerning the indwelling Christ and how believers receive him without so much as a wave of the hand and jump to a passage that is anecdotal and is in NO WAY addressing the INDWELLING HOLY GHOST that could not have taken place in any one UNTIL Jesus Christ had paid the sin debt and the sin washed away by his blood.

The Holy Ghost has a ministry before the cross long before, but including, Elizebeth, Mary, and John the Baptist, but it was not to permanently indwell them and give them life.

Joh 11:25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:

2Co 4:11 For we which live are alway delivered unto death for Jesus’ sake, that the life also of Jesus might be made manifest in our mortal flesh.

DOT,

1Jo 5:12 He that hath the Son hath life; [and] he that hath not the Son of God hath not life.

That is the elect and the non elect!

But, who has life and how did they get it?

Well, in my previous post I proved that the Spirit IS LIFE! Ro 8:10b

But our verse above says that he that hath THE SON hath life. How can this be?

Consider this!
to be strengthened with might by his Spirit in the inner man;
17 That Christ may dwell in your hearts by faith; Ep 1:16b and 17a.

And this

Ro 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

So then, Christ dwells in us in the form of his Spirit!

But how and on what basis do we have the Spirit?

Consider this rhetorical question to the Galatians by Paul.

Ga 3:2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

And this!

Ga 3:14 That the blessing of Abraham might come on the Gentiles through Jesus Christ; that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.

The blessing of Abe and the Spirit are one and the same!

DefenderofTruth wrote:
JD, if you are truly open to understanding God's Word, you will not get hung up on maintaining your position of "which comes first." What matters is that we submit to God's Word.

Hearing
repentance
faith
regeneration

Acts 11:18b Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance UNTO life. Joh 6:47 Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me hath everlasting life. Ro 8:10b but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

Tit 3:5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

Regeneration is the same as being saved! See above! It is the same as renewing of the Holy Ghost!

Ga 3:22 But the scripture hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus Christ might be given to them that believe.

The promise IS THE SPIRIT! See Ga 3:14

DefenderofTruth wrote:
My only desire in discussing is that the Truth of the Word be upheld and that God be glorified as He unfolds His Word to us.

All who has been chosen from before the foundation of the world and is regenerated without their knowledge and approval and then given faith and repentance without a promise from God that they can rest their eternal soul upon is in danger of not being saved at all. Certainly they cannot know it for sure. Now I hope you are saved in spite of a lack of a testimony of God being in your personal conversion but frankly it would worry me to think about showing up before God without assurance that he has made a personal promise to me that I am saved.

Here is an example of a promise that God cannot go back on.

Ro 10:9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved. 13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

I know the time I called upon him for salvation. This is his promise to me. He cannot lie.

Sounds like you repented before you believed. All I am asking is you get it right. So far, you've been all over the place.

You wrote:
I am a Christian who understands my own depravity - inability to come to God on my own
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If you did not come to God then you are fooling your self. Pious, religious, but saved without coming to God????? Who saved you?
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Delivered

Did you actually read that post?
They wrote
so grieves for and hates his sins as to turn from them all unto God,a purposing and endeavoring to walk with him in all the ways of his commandments.
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This is not describing a grace of God, it is describimg and act of the repenter. I am asking your theology to be consistent. You are a smart man. You know it is not!
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Defender of Truth.

Thank you, I will.

But consider this.

I have just been to the sermon archives and reviewed some reformed titles on the subject of repentance. I looked at titles and read comments on the sermons bt Washer, Suskia, and Martim, a reformed Baptist and I think I will listen to this message a little later to see if it aligns with what I am being told here.

Repentance #1: Necessity for Salvation

What else can one do? Change the subject?

Defender of Truth wrote

If you were the lone survivor of a fatal plane crash, would you look around at the wreckage and loss of life and declare that you were smart to have chosen the seat you were sitting in, or the position of your body when the accident occurred? If you were like most people, you would wonder "why me?"
_

Ec 9:11 I returned, and saw under the sun, that the race [is] not to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, neither yet bread to the wise, nor yet riches to men of understanding, nor yet favour to men of skill; but time and chance happeneth to them all.
_

From the UK too wrote:
a] Is this not akin to JW teachings?
b] "If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us"

What I would like for you to do is explain why repentance should be preached to lost people and that we are neglecting our duty if we fail to do it.

I will address your questions later.

Lets not get silly here.

Lazarus was a justified man before he died. Bringing a dead body back to life is not the type that God has set for a spiritual rebirth. Men who are not dead physically experiences a new birth and never has a physically dead man ever experiencesd a new birth. There is a spiritual application and doctrine to the raising of Lazarus but to teach us of a personal born again experience is not it.

Death in the scriptures is a separation. It does not mean men are incapable of knowing, hearing, feeeling, understanding like a dead carcass. It is absurd to suggest it is.

Michael, When you say "total, absolute unconditional predestination," that misrepresents what the Calvinistic says.

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I don't know what your brand of tulip is but you need to go and learn what these men on this forum teach and then come back and lets talk.

____

The Lone Wolf in his last post has totally misrepresented my position on saving faith and our position non calvinists, on how we approach the gospel of Jesus Christ. There is no point in dealing with it because everyone here knows it but none will rebuke him.

UK Too wrote

A sinner cannot repent in the natural state, because he does not know what sin is never mind repentance.

AND

If the Holy Spirit does the work of Faith in the sinner, and He does, then what you preach/teach an unsaved sinner, on the Biblical love of God (or any Truth doctrine) is not going to settle between his ears and convert him anyway.

You obviously did not read the complaint of the man called quote and he that is called UK man. Their camplaint was that street preachers and pulpiteers were not preaching repentance from sin (as if a lost man can repent). I will post their complaint again for you in my next post.

The comments and reasoning in the last few posts by the calvinists would surely suggest a very great need for the men in the white jackets if it were any subject under discussion besides religion.

The bottom line here is that we have been told that repentance is the gift of God and it takes place in a practical time environment of God's own choosing and it is after regeneration which makes the contention that the street preachers and the pulpiteers guilty of not preaching a message that will save a very confusing proposition. You cannot have God commanding men to repent after regeneration if he has regenerated them so he can give them repentance. And certainly if this is true the complaint of quote and uk man makes no sense whatsoever.