Michael Hranek wrote:
DB
No! Shame on you!
The gospel is NOT God loves you and has a wonderful plan for your life. And you know this is NOT what I preach or post here on SA but rather God's love for the lost in context of the cross that they might repent and believe in Jesus Christ for the gift of God eternal life.

You are a rare breed preaching repentance and faith. Most IFB consider that works salvation. They much prefer the easy believism of 1-2-3 repeat after me. It looks good for their numbers and maybe get their church name and picture in the periodicals.

Michael Hranek wrote:
DB
NO! That's not my job at all.

There is a love of God that goes out to the whole world. Just like a father has a love for his neighbor's children, but not the intimate love he has for his own children because they are his own.

(Jer 31:3) "The LORD hath appeared of old unto me, saying, Yea, I have loved thee with an everlasting love: therefore with lovingkindness have I drawn thee."

They were born into his family, he gave them life, he disciplines them because they are his. He doesn't discipline someone elses.

Weapon of Mass Instruction wrote:
2. If God willed unconditional election, why does he not simply state it in his word?

(John 15:16) "Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain:..."

Weapon of Mass Instruction wrote:
3. If God willed limited atonement, why does he not simply state it in his word?

Weapon of Mass Instruction wrote:
Now three easy Questions for Calvinist.

1. If God loves only a few, why does he simply state this simple truth in his word?

(Mal 1:2-3) "I have loved you, saith the LORD. Yet ye say, Wherein hast thou loved us? Was not Esau Jacob's brother? saith the LORD: yet I loved Jacob, 3. And I hated Esau, and laid his mountains and his heritage waste for the dragons of the wilderness."

(John 16:27) "For the Father himself loveth you, because ye have loved me, and have believed that I came out from God."

(Joh 14:21) "He that hath my commandments, and keepeth them, he it is that loveth me: and he that loveth me shall be loved of my Father, and I will love him, and will manifest myself to him."

(Psalm 5:5) "The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity."

Weapon of Mass Instruction wrote:
2. If God willed unconditional election, why does he not simply state it in his word?

Weapon of Mass Instruction wrote:
3. If God willed limited atonement, why does he not simply state it in his word?

BTW, the historicist views of Larkin, JD etal are in good company with most of the reformers who held the similar position that the seven churches represent seven time periods of church history and that the pope was the anti-christ. The reformed group who are not amil are historic postmillennial.

Weapon of Mass Instruction wrote:
Actually, its no contradiction at all. Imminent means that Jesus can come at any moment, NOT at a specific time.
Try again.

The doctrine of the imminent rapture means that it could happen at any moment. There were no more prophecies that would have to be fulfilled before the Lord returns to rapture the church.

It seem that noone is allowed to share their opinions without getting viciously assaulted and slashed on these boards by people who claim to be Christian pastors and teachers.

What I also find interesting is that if one comes from one side and expresses similar views and opinions f the other that differ from theirs, they are venomously attacked.

Case in point, I was trained in all of the ways and thinking of the dispensational IFB. After studying scripture on my own and seeing what exactly does the bible teach, my views have changed. What is interesting is that those who I considered brothers and friends in Christ have now turned vicious. Is this what Christianity has evolved to?

kevin wrote:
And when he made reference to the meeting in the clouds in the air, I truly believe that he used symbolism into the clouds as being those saints in their white righteous robes.

And

Moderator Alpha wrote:
Must this thread be closed to restore civility to the forum?
I strongly encourage all users to gather their Christian wits about them and conduct themselves accordingly.
Thank you.

kevin wrote:
Are you familiar with his chart? And if so, what is your opinion on the chart?
I didn't put much thought into it back then. Really wasn't a fan of his thoughts.
Kevin

This from Scofield:

"2 But three creative acts of God are recorded in this chapter: (1) the heavens and the earth, v. 1; (2) animal life, v. 21; and (3) human life, vs. 26, 27. The first crea¬tive act refers to the dateless past, and gives scope for all the geologic ages.

3 Jer. 4. 23-26, Isa. 24. 1 and 45. 18, clearly indicate that the earth had undergone a cataclysmic change as the result of a divine judgment. The face of the earth bears everywhere the marks of such a catastrophe. There are not wanting intimations which connect it with a previous testing and fall of angels. See Ezk. 28. 12-15 and Isa. 14. 9-14, which certainly go beyond the kings of Tyre and Babylon."

Continuing from Clarence Larkin's "The Book of Revelation" here is how the dispensationalist crowd interpret the 7 churches.

1. Ephesus (A Backslidden Church) 70 A.D to 170 A.D.

2. Smyrna (A Persecuted Church) 170 A.D. to Constantine 312 A.D.

3. Pergamos (A Licentious Church) Constantine 312 A.D. to 606 A.d. when Boniface III was crowned "Universal Bishop"

4. Thyatira (A Lax Church) 606 A.d. to the Reformation 1520 A.d.

5. Sardis (A Dead Church) 1520 A.D. to about 1750 A.D.

6. Philadelphia (A Favored Church) 1750 A.D. to 1900 A.D.

7. Laodicea (A Lukewarm Church) 1900 A.D. to the Rapture of the church.

JD wrote:
MurrayA,
I think DB lies and I do not know what is motivating him now.

No problem. Disregatd the previous post

"Your welcome. I would put him right out there next to Calvin".

Weapon of Mass Instruction wrote:
ANy system of belief that orginated in impriosning and persecuting people simply because of a difference in a theological system is as cultish as the present day drinking the red koolaid.
Now that's the dehvastating truth.

"The Things Which Are,"
and which inclurles chapters two and three, must be a description or prophetic outline of the "Spiritual History" of the Church from the time when John wrote the Book in A.D. 96, down to the taking out of the Church, or else we have no "prophetic view" of the Church during that period, for she disappears from the earth at the close of chapter three, and is not seen again until she reappears with her Lord in chapter nineteen. This we shall find to be the case. See Chart of the Book of Revelation.

This interpretation of *** the "Messages to the Seven Churches" was hidden to the early Church,*** because time was required for Church History to develop and be written, so a comparison could be made to reveal the correspondence. If it had been clearly revealed that the Seven Churches stood for "Seven Church Periods" that would have to elapse before Christ could come back, the incentive to watch would have been absent."

Weapon of Mass Instruction wrote:
If you are not in 100% doctrinal agreement with your pastor (especially with such a polarizing issue as this) then you should move on to another church, instead of Lurking around subverting the doctrinal convictions of the pastor.

I am all for sound doctrine and that is why there is a thing as soul liberty. Seems like the baptist forefathers in the US fought for this to get out from under the Church of England.

God indwells every believer to guide them in all truth and their is no confusion with God. Calvinism does not have all the answers, but the do recognize that God is sovereign in all things, something which you and JD do not, but recognize your precious freewill as sovereign.