JD wrote:
I prescribe strait-jackets for anyone who talks this sovereignty stuff and then comments as if it is not true.

Derek wrote:
what I do know is that Children under the "age of accountability" go to heaven.

Talking about hurricanes!!
The wind blowing through the non-Reformed churches is well described here.

JD wrote:
Your past comments have taught me that your are the most ill equipped calv on the forum to defend your positions. You rarely make any sense and you offer lots of smoke to cover your ignorance of Scripture and your own adopted doctinal system.
No one has to take my word for it. They just need to read your comments for a while. You can fake it for just so long!

I'm really glad you identify the difference between us so clearly for all to see.

By the grace of God I'm also glad that I'm not Like you per your::

* Dispy PreTrib/Premil.
* Of the 19th century religion of Darby/Scofield et al.
* Not to mention poor little dreamer, Margaret MacDonald.
* Anti-Covenant (even though God established the Covenant of Grace)
* Divisionary of Scripture.
* Literalist.
* Revisionist.
* Rejecter of Israel contrary to Romans 11.
* Numerologist.
* Synergist/Arminian.
* Papist synpathiser.

I'm sure I may have missed some of your qualifications JD. But we can pick these up from your future revelations.

Quack Yamil Luciano wrote:
Now here is the biggest irony in this debate:
The Calvinist (Walt and Seaton) favor divorce which would mean that one can lose his salvation, while the full blown Arminian (Abigail and Spiritual) propose the opposite which would affirm eternal security.
Am I the only one that see the irony out of all this?
That's why you should stick with me folks. (wink-wink)

These words are taken from the Bible a book which Yamil is still floundering with.

1Cor 7:14 "For the unbelieving husband is sanctified by the wife, and the unbelieving wife is sanctified by the husband: else were your children unclean; but now are they holy."

This is the Word of God!

As opposed to the teachings of the Non-Reformed Church.

As for "irony"
Dictionary says = "the use of words to convey a meaning that is the opposite of its literal meaning"

""I am sorry but I believe you "JD" are lost if the testimony of words can be believed.
You are not able to see and perceive spiritual truth and always resort to humanistic reasoning and counsel.

You deny truth that is presented to you plainly because it does not fit your religious template.

For one to think the repentant sinner "can first defeat the ends of sin and only then be *rewarded* with the Holy Spirit, who is given as a gift and essentially defines the grace of God, is to miss the whole essence of NT truth concerning the church, the new birth, and the family of God.

Blindness (ignorance) is the pitiful condition of the non-Reformed. I am not happy about this. I am sad!""

The problem of course is within the denomination rather than the secular legislation. Had the church itself not commited the transgression of putting women into the pulpit, then this could never happen. The solution is if your denomination leaves the Bible, then YOU must leave the church!

Dr. Frankenstien Yamil Luciano wrote:
I am just content being the Weapon of Mass Instruction, the heretical destoyer of truth and the Doctor in charge of the pollution of all Truth.
I prescribe me a much needed sincere heart.

Abigail wrote:
Two wrongs do not make a right. If one person sins, that is no reason for the other to disobey God's commandments.
People marry carelessly. They become physically attracted and think they are in love,

What are you talking about Abigail???

Two wrongs???

I was referring to TWO PEOPLE getting married then one becomes a Christian the other does not. Thus if the non Christian decides to divorce, then there is NOTHING the Christian can do about it, is there?

Reality check!!!

As to "people marrying carelessly" as you put it. Question Abigail are you married? Do you know what the experience of "young" love is like?

They may not seek God and His law because they may not be Christian, at that stage in their lives, if so then HE will not have an input.
Not everybody is a Christian you know.

John wrote:
Yamil's posts usually annoy me with their Arminian overtones,
but on this thread he is my HERO because he vigorously preaches
against the 90% of my fellow reformers who still think divorce
is OK

Human beings are not perfect surprise! surprise!

Divorce like sin, iniquity and transgression is a REALITY in this world.

We would all like to remove these vile and depraved ways of men and women.

But then REALITY!

Just as Yamil suffers from being in the law of sin and the flesh, he too could suffer divorce. Arminian religion does not protect us from sin any more than the true Biblical religion does.

Moses provided a certificate of divorce for the Israelites, (Deut 24) because of the "hardness of their heart." (Matt 19:8) This commodity is not the unique preserve of the Isrealites, as is evidenced in society and churches today.

Two people enter into marriage. One may be a Christian or may become a Christian, not necessarily both. Divorce sadly may thus become a REALITY for them.

"Indwelling sin always abides whilst we are in this world; therefore it is always to be mortified. The vain, foolish, and ignorant disputes of men about perfect keeping the commands of God, of perfection in this life, of being wholly and perfectly dead to sin, I meddle not now with.

It is more than probable that the men of those abominations never knew what belonged to the keeping of any one of God's commands, and are so much below perfection of degrees, that they never attained to a perfection of parts in obedience or universal obedience in sincerity.

And, therefore, many in our days who have talked of perfection have been wiser, and have affirmed it to consist in knowing no difference between good and evil. Not that they are perfect in the things we call good, but that all is alike to them, and the height of wickedness is their perfection.

Liberalism is of course the religion of the WCC, and the politics of the UN. So both go hand in hand in the world today anyway. Their desire to "merge" religions is no new thing to those who can't read the Bible, or receive the True Biblical Doctines.

As for "global peace and harmoney" this is about as possible to mankind as - Liberals teaching the Truth.

= If you can't receive the Truth from Scripture - Then you will use and apply the alternatives. How to form a heresy has not changed down through the centuries.

Quote 2]
When asked whether Scientology's values contradict the religion of Jesus Christ, Kennedy replies, "Sometimes yes. Sometimes no." But he says his congregation can relate to "The Way to Happiness."

= Happiness in this world is precisely what Satan wants you to find. That brings you to seek outside the True Church and Biblical Doctrines. Classic cultology.
(And of course social gospel)

The fact that we see here "Pentecostal" and "Episcopalian" preachers, speaks volumes to the error of their ways.

And today our politically correct liberal gouls in parliament want to make it easier to murder a baby in the womb.

Abigail wrote:
I do believe the principal effect cause of the performance of this duty is the Spirit. I am very aware that without the Spirit we can do nothing—we are nothing—we are helpless. I do not believe in irresistible grace. God draws us by His Spirit and gives us desire to come to Him, but we can resist or submit.
...freewill does not minimize the power of the Spirit

This seems paradoxical Abigail.

If you conclude the Spirit is "cause" in mortifying sin and subsequently "live" due to this cause.
Then the mortal is NOT cause.
If as you say we are "helpless" without the Spirit. Then we can do zero to mortify and live.

How then can we "resist" the power of the Spirit?

God draws. - But HE apparently is not "God" enough to overcome the mortal.
The "desire" which HE provides is insufficient to the purpose of God to save?

Michael Hranek wrote:
Your previous posts and others seem to give the impression that Calvinists don't believe they are responsible to do anything,

Tell me, what do you think is the solution to Paul's conundrum here?

Jim Lincoln wrote:
Seaton, you have fallen into the same error that the great

As for Gil and his TUIP as opposed to TULIP. Tell him my advice is to study harder.

Remember TULIP 5 points was a Biblical reaction to the Arminian Remonstrance 5 points.
If you remove the centre piece "L" then the cards come tumbling down, and you end up an arminian heretic.

Article 8 (2nd Head) Canons of Dordt.

Abigail wrote:
Pray tell, how do you Calvinists mortify the deeds of the body so that you are not living after the flesh—since you believe that "not of works" means abandonment of the moral law and

Grace and the Holy Spirit IS the ONLY means by which any mortal can repent and come to Christ. Prior to this all are "dead in sin" and at enmity with God.

Therefore the "efficient cause" of the duty of mortifying sin is THE Holy Spirit.

As the verse states.
"but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live."

Walking in the flesh is the "old man"
Walking in the Spirit is the "new man"
When the Lord saved me His promise is that I am saved by Grace and the Holy Spirit. Since that time my life thoughts and heart have changed and still continue to do so. The Holy Spirit sanctifies me, which is an ongoing work in progress.